This year, I've got my kids doing a homeschool co-op two days a week. This just means that a group of homeschool parents have organized to teach their children in a group setting, and possibly hire a teacher or two for subjects where more formal education might be helpful (languages, music, science?).
Unfortunately, the coop we have joined is quite some way from our home, so after dropping off the children, I go to a nearby coffee shop to work -- a coffee shop that has a Square terminal.
I have asked if they accept Bitcoin a number of times so far, but in all cases the cashier's answer has been "I don't think so" or "I'll have to talk to the person who manages this" (pointing at the terminal). It's a busy place and so there is often a line, and I haven't wanted to try to make anyone wait while I help figure out how to turn on Bitcoin payments, and so I haven't made much progress.
Today, the person behind the cash register was the owner and I seized my opportunity.
I placed my order and while he was ringing it up, I said, "I've heard that these Square terminals accept bitcoin."
The owner glanced up at me and said, "I've heard that, too. Let's see if we can figure it out."
This was a much more enthusiastic response than I was expecting. He poked away at the terminal for a few minutes and then said, "I think it only takes bitcoin if you have CashApp."
I told him that this was not the case, but that if he could get it to display a QR code I could try paying that.
He continued to tap on the terminal without much effect. I should say this terminal was not the sort that has a rotatable screen. There is one fixed screen facing the cashier and a smaller fixed screen facing the customer. This was showing the message "Waiting for cashier..."
"I think you have to tap to pay," he said.
Now, I don't use any of the Lightning wallets that have implemented tap to pay (as far as I remember there aren't very many) so that wasn't an option. I told him that I needed a QR code to scan.
After another couple minutes, the owner volunteered: "Maybe I can text it to you."
I am usually loathe to provide a phone number, but in the interest of dismantling the legacy financial system, I gave it to him. I immediately received a text with a link. The link was to pay for my coffee, but had required fields for name, phone number, and email. At the bottom I saw a green button that said pay with CashApp or something like that. I tapped it, but nothing happened because I had not entered the required fields.
Still in the interest of taking down the fiat empire, I entered some incorrect information in these fields. But then when I tapped the green button, it presented me with a message informing me that I did not have CashApp and a button to download CashApp.
At this point the line behind me was long enough that I offered to pay with cash and the owner accept with some visible signs of relief.
So: I have failed on this the fourth time I've tried to pay with Bitcoin at this Square terminal. I suspect that the owner needs to turn Bitcoin payments on and that I will need to talk him through this process, so I'll have to rewatch those videos about how to do this.
It occurs to me that Square could do a lot better with this flow if they had a button that allowed the cashier to display a QR code that was simultaneously a CashApp code and a Lightning invoice. This is a lot to ask, but I'm pretty sure it needs to be at least that easy for it to work well.
There is a coffee shop that I frequent that has a square terminal which supports lightning payments. There, it gives the option to the payer rather than the recipient, so the payer can simply choose the Bitcoin symbol in the top left corner rather than making the staff aware that they wish to pay with bitcoin at all. Perhaps the terminal in your case is on an old version of the software or doesn’t support lightning? I can try to snap a picture of the option on the screen next time, if that would be of interest.
Yes, it must be older. I've visited terminals that have the customer facing toggle, but that isn't available here (at least not until they figure out how to turn something on from their side).
Gotcha, thanks for clarifying.
The next step would be getting a job at Square. Just kidding, I love your persistence.
YEEES. This is how I envision this... get-together with a bunch of parents having different skills and teach all 3-7 kids sequentially/rotating.
ah yes, Scoresby talking dirty to me
Just pretend you're from Square, there to fix their terminal because you've received reports of failed bitcoin payments, then show them this post. The merchant will think Square is extremely proactive, Square gets another merchant accepting bitcoin, and you can finally pay in bitcoin. Win-win-win!
This is a very good idea. I'm not brave enough, though.
I think with enough information, someone could pull this off. With some public information that seems private, like a store ID that usually only managers care about, you could fake legitimacy. Combined with being there to help (which isn’t wrong), I think the employees or shift manager would trust enough to let the social engineer try.
The excuse for not knowing what they’re doing could be, “Oh, that’s an old version of our interface.”
Order some of these kits to hand out in such situations: https://squareup.com/us/en/bitcoin, they're free to send to you by mail so you can hand them out. I've honestly never even taken the time to look at them myself. I just know that I've handed out a bunch already (first 10= gone. I got another pack of 10 around here somewhere but I'd have to dig for them).
At least the guy didn’t just say no and walk away :)
Agreed! They are really very receptive.
I wonder if it isn't worth investing in a square terminal just to try it out yourself.
I hadn't considered that because I assume I need some sort of subscription or something (and probably have to do KYC). I'm going to get a lightning wallet that does tap to pay and try that next (as well as continuing to cajole them into figuring it out).
Hmm, if Gemini is to be believed, it doesn't require a subscription for the basic software, and the terminal itself goes for around $299.
Maybe i'll try it. It would make for an excellent Stacker News post.
It would, indeed! There are a number of videos online that show how to do it, so you probably don't need to spend the money, but it certainly would be a cool post!
A worthy effort.
Yeah this sounds like a square education issue. Although if customers aren't asking to pay in Bitcoin there is really no incentive to learn how to accept it from the merchant's end.
Now that you are text buddies why don't you send him a tutorial on how to activate bitcoin payments on his end. Haha
Sadly, the text came from the terminal, so I don't have his number so much as whatever number Square uses to send out these messages.
Honestly, I need to do figure it out for myself so I can coach them through it next time.
You may not have succeeded, but you moved the ball down the field.
I'd like to say it's in their court now, but likely I'll need to try for a hail mary next.
Appreciate you publishing your attempts
tap to pay is NFC?
Yes, NFC. I don't have Zeus on my daily driver phone. A number of the cashu wallets have NFC as well.
If the square terminal is set up to present LN address it will have bitcoin listed in the “check out options” after the merchant tallies up your goods, no matter how you are paying, they click “check out” on their side and then click cash, credit, or bitcoin if it’s available. So if you see a square terminal in the wild you can expedite the finding out process by saying “when you click on check out do you see a bitcoin option?” If they don’t then they have to activate it themselves.
I am starting to see the toggle that Jack advertised more and more in the top left corner. Multiple times I’ve used that toggle to pay with bitcoin and had the merchant go “woah I’ve never seen anyone do that before” it’s really cool. I’m actually not sure what they’re seeing on their side when that happens.
This is helpful, thanks. I was looking for the toggle, but I haven't seen it on this terminal. I suspect they either haven't updated their software in a while or they haven't turned on Bitcoin payments (assuming that is still a required step).
October 26-30is buy Scoresby coffee with bitcoin time
four attempts, each with an audience. first rule of paying with lightning: no witnesses. my node routes at 3am and i still feel judged.
You gotta respect the effort :)