Phoenix Wallet, way underestimated on-chain fees and no RBF??? \ stacker news ~bitcoin

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Phoenix Wallet, way underestimated on-chain fees and no RBF???

55 sats \ 8 comments \ @l0k18 6 May 2023 bitcoin

I had a somewhat unpleasant experience just now with the binary vomit flood in full effect at the moment, doing a submarine swap using Phoenix wallet.

First problem was the fee it set was like 1/8th of the average fee for the next block.

Second problem was the transaction has no RBF, and I was unable to push it forward and it may be stuck for a day or more.

Just a heads up in case you are using it with on-chain transactions, I advise not to, find another wallet that actually has RBF for on chain. It is the swap service that has to send out the tx, I guess that's the story with that.

The lack of option to set the fee manually in the on chain payment interface of Phoenix is a really annoying thing for me today. Sats jammed up in the wires, no way I can see to fix it. They aren't my keys, it's a submarine swap.

Still super excited about LN but I would enjoy taking a certain set of black sunglasses and crushing it in a hydraulic press so hard it is vaporised.

I still say that no cap on witness data per tx is a dumb idea.

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1353 sats \ 2 replies \ @DarthCoin 6 May 2023

Phoenix, Breez, Nayuta are LN dedicated wallets. Are not supposed to be used for onchain txs. Swaps they provide are not meant to be used so often or in these strange situations we are today with these fucking ordinals.

Phoenix should be treated as LN wallet only. The onchain feature is dedicated only to open channels on the fly and when is needed, to refill drained channels.

Blixt, OBW, Electrum have better control over onchain wallet and txs. OBW for example have RBF, batch txs and other features for onchain. Electrum also is powerful for onchain rxs and also including swaps with LN.

I explained all features of these wallets in my guides. Also I explained that choosing a LN wallet is a very important task and also do not use just one. I suggested also to use external submarine swaps, where you can control better the fees and the swap, so your tx couldn't get stuck for mistakes.

I use Phoenix too, but I do not use too much the swap feature. My sats are spread in many wallets so whenever is needed, I can choose the one that have enough sats and for each situation. Here I explained how I use Phoenix

21 sats \ 1 reply \ @l0k18 OP 6 May 2023

As always, the highest quality of responses. Once the wounds heal I'll move on to bigger and better things, thanks to your help.

30 sats \ 0 replies \ @DarthCoin 6 May 2023

Thanks. Don't get me wrong, you don't have to move totally from Phoenix. Phoenix is not a bad app. Just that is limited in some situations. Just use it in specific situations.

Bitcoin is not perfect today, but still we have a lot of apps that could help us in specific situations.

We will never have a "perfect app" that will do all perfectly designed. We just need to adapt to each situation and know how to use many apps.

23 sats \ 2 replies \ @TonyGiorgio 6 May 2023

All of Phoenix's on chain interactions are custodial. They create their own addresses when you receive and they make the payments when you send on chain.

They aren't even atomic swaps. You pay invoice, they promise to make on chain payment.

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @slender_trikes_0c 6 May 2023

For one who does not wish to run/manage his own node, do you recommend any iOS lightning app over phoenix?

123 sats \ 0 replies \ @TonyGiorgio 6 May 2023

I mean they're all going to have their trade off's. I'd use muun for on chain transactions and sometimes lightning, or phoenix for mostly lightning and sometimes on chain. Hard to get the best of both on chain and lightning, probably best to keep them seperated if you can manage.

23 sats \ 0 replies \ @ealvar26 6 May 2023

I found some really high fees yesterday. Like 40,000 sats for an normal onchain transaction. Maybe that's what goofed it up.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @slender_trikes_0c 6 May 2023

I had the same experience when paying ~5 euro for a month of mullvad vpn with phoenix. I could see the transaction on mempool.space, but took almost a day to be confirmed. I agree with Darth that phoenix is best used as a lightning wallet. But hope also that businesses that currently only accept on chain (thank you for that though), will soon accept lightning payment too.