Foundry Founders: What's the point of having territories? \ stacker news ~meta

Foundry Founders: What's the point of having territories?

1158 sats \ 44 comments \ @mo 12 Mar meta

It's clear that people come here because of bitcoin, and at this point I'm struggling to understand the point of territories. It can be seen as a mere speculative product offered by SN. In the other side, I'm glad ~builders find it useful for @PlebLab own purposes. There are ways to make territories more useful apart all our ~lightning, ~econ that we all share knowledge with. ~Music is a great example and I feel like it's making the most of it with its Daily Discussion Thread, Throwback Thursday and other weekly recurring posts. Keep it up Pub! ~Stacker_Sports has been entertaining many of us with its Stacker Sports - Day... (nearly reach #100 congrats!) and many other polls and bounties.

We are also seeing territories dying pretty often, probably at the same rate they came up! The last one from Giorgio letting ~ecash die, it's a bit of a pity!

It's fascinating to see some successful territories taking some space and differentiate the conversations around bitcoin. I assume that is on the territory owners (for now) to come up with brilliant ideas for engagement and invite stackers to use and post on territories accordingly. I feel a bit better now that I drop the ~AGORA and I can finally enjoy a bit more SN again. In my short experience as TO, I can ensure it took a lot of effort to bring the marketplace where it is standing now, and I'm happy to see some organic posts on it. However, I'd like to see some community effort on creating guidelines and exchanging opinions on how to use the territories and the best way of supporting founders¹. That's probably why I'm writing this post! I surely look forward to new features to come soon, allowing co-ownership and territory contributions/rewards distribution, enabling stackers to be on the same squad, or maybe on multiple squads to play together and bring SN to the next level.

But my main question is more about ~bitcoin: Bitcoin fix everything, bitcoin applies to everything... and in the same way, it applies to nothing too! I've personally muted the territory as it is a constant-noise-generator-machine. These days hot feels like a rat race to MSM prizes, recent an infinite link chain to external posts and videos... Search works much better for me! And thanks Satoshi fees to post on ~bitcoin now have raised to 1k! Would it make a change? Would you follow the lead and help cutting the noise out? How could we build some strategies for encouraging users to post in the appropriate territory?

I understand it takes time for users to adapt to a new system. Territories are nearly three month old now and has been fun to watch it evolving, and hey! We also have @DarthCoin back, making a difference on this New Wild West!

I'd be curious to know your thoughts, as a territory founder, how has your experience been so far? Or did you just found it and let it be in a laissez-faire approach?

view all related items

529 sats \ 1 reply \ @Public_N_M_E 12 Mar

Thanks for the shout out @mo 👊 I'm doing my best. Despite it feeling at times like this,

But as small as the community is in ~Music it's for people like GR, Roll, 0b1, 02 Jess, jerry and a whole bunch of new nyms I havnt mentioned, who show up every day to share another hobby/passion with other like minded people.

Bitcoin may be how and why we found SN, but we're not just BTC farms we're people with lives and stories, talking about things like sports and music and movies (RIP ~Movies) allows us to build connections with people in a world where connection seems to be rare. Each song posted comes with a memory for both the poster and the person listening, sometimes it's story time and we dive into those memories, sometimes we keep them to ourselves. But each time... For an average length of 3minutes and 45seconds (numbers plucked from the sky but that sounds about right for a song). We shared something. In today's world where we are more physically connected to people than ever before, we are further from meaningful connections with people than we've ever been.

If I have a small part in helping someone feel that connection for 3minutes of their day, I'll chalk that up in the win column.

We recently had someone releasing new music and is using our Pinned posts to advertise their work in celebration of their upcoming album and book! This is huge and I'm glad ~music could be a part of that story.

More real talk, the territory does need financial assistance, just like every other territory, with the fiat cost of BTC now, it's becoming more of a barrier to providing these spaces for people. So without wanting to sound like I'm begging. I'd certainly appreciate those dailies and weeklies getting a few more zaps. I'm not in this for money, that's not what that's about for me. I hope I made that clear further up, but it'd be a great shame if people lost those spaces like music and sports and others where we get real connection for fleeting moments of our days.

From a BItcoin point of view, bitcoin is truth, if people want it, they'll vote with their sats... The problem is... "Everyone likes, nobody zaps" 🤣. So much interaction and engagement but so few zaps. Eventually people will learn that the more you zap the more you earn, but we haven't got there yet. (And god I hope ~Music survives these growing pains).

As far as the music territory is concerned I will continue to do all I can to keep that space alive for those people and for small time artists who come to SN for the bitcoin but stay for the connections.

#growSN #growMusic #SoapBoxMoment #ThankYouForComingToMyTEDTalk #SillyHashtagsAreSilly #DidIGetEnoughPointlessHashtagsIn #Hashtag

Edit. Apologies for the wall of text... It seemed I had a lot to say 🤣

21 sats \ 0 replies \ @mo OP 12 Mar

Thanks for sharing so much about ~music! It’s interesting for me to watch and better understand all your work behind it. I think enabling conversations is more important that receiving zaps. Something I’ve struggled with the ~AGORA

202 sats \ 7 replies \ @antic 12 Mar

I think we are still very early and territories are a subtle knife in the side of reddit. Ultimately, why would anyone use Reddit? For karma? Why would you spend time on stock traded platforms that are selling your data to Google (Reddit ipo is days away) if you had an option of building the same communities powered by sats instead of karma points. Sure, it’s a long road and Reddit has a huge user activity base, but I’d move it all here if it were up to me.

I think as people realize that platforms are making huge amounts of money from their usage and time, they will seek honest communities built upon an honest ledger. Same goes for Steem/Hive. All of those communities would be better here.

149 sats \ 5 replies \ @Public_N_M_E 12 Mar

Preach 👊. Value for value isn't something the masses yet understand... Magic internet points?? Karma?? Ha! Nah I would appreciate something more real, more tangible.

132 sats \ 4 replies \ @0xbitcoiner 12 Mar

As I've said on sn before, V4V is a tough nut to crack for most forum goers. It's not for everyone, that's for sure.

122 sats \ 3 replies \ @Public_N_M_E 12 Mar

Agree 0x it does take a huge leap from the "HODL" mantra preached everywhere else.

Here we encourage people to stack sats but also zap Sats to benefit the economy.

In other places it's just straight up HODL and never let go. That kind of conditioning takes some time to let go. No one wants to be the guy who bought 2 pizzas for what is now life changing money.

42 sats \ 2 replies \ @0xbitcoiner 12 Mar

Another thing that confuses most people is having to pay to post. I've tried to bring friends here and the response is unanimous: 'You're crazy! Paying to post?'

85 sats \ 1 reply \ @mo OP 12 Mar

They underestimate the value back one get on sharing knowledge! If you tell them you getting paid to write good quality content they may be change their minds

21 sats \ 0 replies \ @0xbitcoiner 12 Mar

I've already made that argument. Most people just like to scroll down furiously 🤣

21 sats \ 0 replies \ @0xbitcoiner 12 Mar

💯

182 sats \ 2 replies \ @nout 12 Mar

We now have this amazing breakthrough that can sort the best content by not just hype & ads, but by actual value. Put your money where your mouth is. This is what SN provides and it provides it for any type of content, it doesn't need to be bitcoin related.

In other news: If you post great content to ~gaming, I will pay you good sats :) I like gaming, I hate ads.

21 sats \ 0 replies \ @Public_N_M_E 12 Mar

Reference ~gaming stay strong PS/PC brethren, keep the pressure on Sony and us XBox soldiers will join the fight against the bugs! (Ref Helldivers2) Reinforcements will come we just need to get Sony to concede ✊

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Public_N_M_E 12 Mar

Talk _____. Share ______. Zap Sats. 🫡

100 sats \ 0 replies \ @lloyddunne 14 Mar

I set up ~antifragile as it represents an ideology I want to live by. Moving fast despite uncertainty, breaking things, exposing yourself to feedback - The resilient resists shocks and stays the same; the antifragile gets better.

I’d rather be dumb and antifragile than extremely smart and fragile, any time.

SN has some great writers here, that I would appreciate hearing takes on this approach to life.

104 sats \ 0 replies \ @0xbitcoiner 12 Mar

This might help. The idea is that the moderators can suspend a post if it is not in correct territory. When a post is suspended, it becomes hidden and the OP is notified to transfer the territory. OP can refuse or accept the suggestion. OP can be penalized by the moderators if they deem it necessary.

170 sats \ 1 reply \ @elvismercury 13 Mar

It is a massive money loser, but for me it's 50% a donation to a site I really care about, and 50% belief in @k00b and @ek and their vision and their principles. It's cool to be a type of founder on something like this.

Oh, and also I'm looking for my people, slowly but surely. (Perhaps one day: gradually then suddenly.)

27 sats \ 0 replies \ @Car 13 Mar

🎯

Support the things and people you love or watch them go away or die.

Even more true in Bitcoin, where fiat money is not present building a company for 97% of Bitcoin startups and projects.

Support the Bitcoin Builders and their projects or don’t be surprised when they become 💩coin projects.

42 sats \ 2 replies \ @grayruby 12 Mar

I have enjoyed having territories but haven't seen the much of the migration of more users to the platform I had thought territories and larger breadth of conversation would bring. It is still early though and I think territory founders and SN itself can do a better job marketing on social media. I am somewhat baffled how few bitcoiners actually use SN. They are really missing out. It is a great site and experience.

71 sats \ 0 replies \ @mo OP 12 Mar

I think a lot will change now with the raised fees at 1k on ~Bitcoin. Maybe ~meta is next?

71 sats \ 0 replies \ @Public_N_M_E 12 Mar

It does seem still small somehow. Could really benefit from a proper advertising campaign. I came to it via a fountain promotion ad. Perhaps that's an avenue to reexpolre since fountain have made lots of changes and had a fair bit of growth since then.

21 sats \ 17 replies \ @TNStacker 12 Mar

I agree with @antic.

I think we are still very early...

It is very interesting to me to see, and try various things. I see potential, so for now I will invest and experiment. Meanwhile, if nothing else, I'll help bring a diverse set of folks to SN. The territory fee is a commitment for sure, so it forces one to think about options for sharing the costs and earning Sats.

42 sats \ 13 replies \ @AGORA 12 Mar

Oh I agree! It's so early, we can feel lonely some time! I've been wondering about bringing new folks to SN and sharing on nostr it's kind of slowly working! How are you planning to ... bring a diverse set of folks to SN?

21 sats \ 0 replies \ @TNStacker 13 Mar

I've had Nostr traction this week. I spend time each morning sending invitations to those posting under hashtags.

21 sats \ 11 replies \ @Public_N_M_E 12 Mar

I'd been sharing on Nostr sometimes... As a mobile user I don't have the right NIP protocols to use the auto crosspost function. So sometimes when I post on SN my dailies before walking into work I don't have time to then duplicate and link that post and post out on Nostr too. But I had seen a slight uptick in new nyms since starting to post on Nostr. If you can commit to doing it every time you post, it does seem to be beneficial. Just doing it manually is sometimes time prohibitive.

74 sats \ 10 replies \ @AGORA 12 Mar

I damn agree! @k00b when the "Share to Nostr" (as a kind 1) button?

21 sats \ 8 replies \ @0xbitcoiner 12 Mar

I've been talking about this for weeks now. The only reason I don't use the cross-post feature is because it doesn't use kind 1. Many clients don't support long-form content.

53 sats \ 7 replies \ @Public_N_M_E 12 Mar

I don't have the technical know-how to have any idea what a kind 1 is... But if we get a easy share to Nostr button out of it, then it sounds great to me.

42 sats \ 0 replies \ @mo OP 12 Mar

Kind 1 it a tipical nostr note, like a tweet

42 sats \ 5 replies \ @0xbitcoiner 12 Mar

Cross-posting is already available on the SN, but it's in the long-form content format. As I mentioned in my response to the AG, some clients don't support it

21 sats \ 4 replies \ @ek 13 Mar

The issue is that kind 1 does not support edits but we have plans to use presigned events. When events are presigned for every edit, we should be able to broadcast the final state for you after the edit timer ran out. Then we can use kind 1 in a way that harmonizes well with SN's UX and features.

This requires some architectural changes though since currently, your browser is broadcasting the events as is done by "normal" nostr clients.

view replies

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @TNStacker 13 Mar

This will help us Territory founders bring more nostriches to SN - no doubt

21 sats \ 2 replies \ @Public_N_M_E 12 Mar

Absolutely agree with this. Each territory is different. I believe it was ~builders who had shown profits recently. (Shout out to them, amazing work). But they're posting fees is 1ksats. Personally, I struggle to believe that my territory users would engage as much as they do with posting fees that high, but any lower and it seems the territory is unable to float itself. Especially when the number of posts perhaps day is largely dominated by my own dailies/weeklies. Now if owners could post for free, that would change things for sure. And I think that's something that SN should look into. I could feasibly edit the post cost. Make it free, post mine, then edit the price back up, but I don't feel good about that, feels somehow dishonest.

But all the time I am learning from other territories. As founders I think we can all learn something from each other.

42 sats \ 0 replies \ @mo OP 12 Mar

We’ll consider that wen you post you do it with a discount and it’s on the best interest of the territory itself. You can maybe try rising it gradually every month and see how it goes

21 sats \ 0 replies \ @TNStacker 13 Mar

I did a test with higher fees and an NSFW tag and instantaneously died. I relowered the posting fee and begged previous content posters to come back. However, it might have been loss of visibility with the NSFW deal. After I build more regulars I may do another test of higher posting fee, but I will look at average economic value for posters - or something like that.

21 sats \ 1 reply \ @OneOneSeven 12 Mar

I founded ~UFOs because I think the topic is the next most important and consequential topic/question after bitcoin. I’ve been in a superposition about the veracity of UFO claims over the last century. Before the UAP hearings in July of 2023, I was more interested in the strange story of anti-gravity research during the 1950’s and story of how quantum physics has seemed to stall with string theory.

After you dip your toes in the vast amount of research that’s out there, I think it’s almost impossible to come away thinking there’s “nothing going.”

By "nothing going on" I mean nothing worth investigating, nothing worth digging into, etc.

I don't know what explanation accounts for this much indirect evidence and at the same time, this little amount of direct evidence. I don't know what the truth is, but I know it's 'out there', meaning not a boring explanation.

So ~UFOs will be around until SN is no more ¹, and I think that serves as a perfect indicator that the subject is worth looking into. I want it to be the new repository for reports, write-ups, AMAs, investigations etc.

I still think an optional indicator for territories that have been fully bought out would be cool, but I can see reasons to not add this information. ↩

117 sats \ 0 replies \ @TNStacker 13 Mar

Yeah this shit is real. I saw in 1977 what the Naval aviators have been seeing in recent years.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Book_It 14 Mar

Just set it up to have it around and see what happens. I just look at it like im hosting a forum for a specific topic for a small group or those who just pop in every now an then. Im just glad to read some neat stuff on here or peoples takes in certain topics.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @BitcoinOutdoors 13 Mar

Hey if you ever want to share your outdoors activities or enjoy others sharing theirs, or tips and tricks of outdoor survival, best gear, or just sharing a beautiful sunset then come to ~Outdoors

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @kepford 13 Mar

mere speculative product offered by SN

Do you think a speculative product offering is a bad thing? Kinda sounds like you do. I'm not a huge fan of territories but everything one does in the free and open market is a speculation. That is unless you can see into the future.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @mo OP 13 Mar

I mention it’s a way to see it. For me it’s a great valuable feature. We tend to categorise everything especially in the knowledge field. It wouldn’t be learning or innovation without it. We have evolved also because this capacity we do have. My point is more that the majority of stackers look’s like does not care and just post anything whenever they can get more attention and sats.

The aim of this post was to find ways to correct it and find ways to educate stackers to post in the most appropriate territory. I hope it will be fixed soon with the release of multi-territory crossposting. Kind of like the idea to pay to add a category/tag to that specific item. Also looking forward to the sun-territories roll out! But still on TO responsibility to help people understand how to do it… I think 💭

Footnotes

Footnotes