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5 sats \ 3 replies \ @fiatbad 21 Apr \ parent \ on: Cashu vs Fedimint bitcoin
Two quick things:
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There are different categories of scaling. ETF's scale Bitcoin as a savings tech, but they do not scale Bitcoin as a MoE. Federations scale Bitcoin for both use-cases. I'm very interested in scaling as an MoE because I view it as an existential threat to Bitcoin if it cannot scale in this category.
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Saying that a properly setup Federation is akin to an SQL database is disgustingly misguided. If the federation is setup well, no single person has unilateral transactional power. It's just a multi-sig setup where potentially a hundred people have 1/100 keys. It's 1000x better than traditional banks, while giving the people the same conveniences as traditional banks. Nothing beats self-custody, but I think Federations can be an incredible middle-ground tradeoff for the average person living paycheck to paycheck anyway.
It doesn't scale it as an MoE either any more than Wallet of Satoshi (SQL database) does, the IOU passes through a Lightning Gateway. Lightning is the scaling layer, not the mint.
no single person has unilateral transactional power.
That's where you're wrong, kiddo.
Fedimints aren't even multisig last I checked, just promises of FROST maybe at some point in the future... even so, for Lightning, there's inherently a single spender because channels are only 2:2
There's also the issue of a single gateway API point of failure that only needs to be taken down to rug your shittokens.
(Ark is also a scam for many of the same reasons)
the average person living paycheck
You're not even debating the tech at this point, just virtue signaling about poors... pathos is at the top of the scammer playbook.
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I think we have different ideas of how Fedimints work. I haven't audited the code, so I could be wrong. But from my understanding your comment that "Lightning is the scaling layer, not the mint" is not correct, and could explain our disconnect.
Lightning works on the edges of mints, to connect them to other mints or other sovereign LN nodes. There could be hundreds of LN node operators within the mint. They get paid in the mint's ecash whenever someone uses their node to route payments to the outer world. But within the mint, ecash is the database layer. The raw Bitcoin held inside the mint is held in a multi-sig setup where potentially hundreds of people hold a single key in offline, cold-storage. Those people could collude to rug pull, and that's why I'm so interested in the social element to this, because there are infinite social-layer ways it can be done. Similar to how banks prevent executives from stealing funds.
So, that's my understanding
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You hold the idealized scammer marketing version you want to be true, I hold the actual technical reality version.
If scaling MoE is your thing, there's Lightning on the protocol level, and custodians on the aggregation level. End of story.
Mints are neither, they're just inefficient databases sold by scammers attempting to distinguish themselves from other databases.
The shittokens are no different than any database record in that all you have is HOPE that someone will exchange you sats for it.
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