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0 sats \ 7 replies \ @claos545 5 Aug \ on: lowering minimum relay feerate may be bad for compact block relay - 0xB10C bitcoin
Fascinating observation. It really shows how small policy shifts,like lowering the minrelaytxfee,can ripple out and affect network-level mechanics like compact block efficiency.
If more miners are including low-fee, non-relayed transactions (e.g., via direct submission or txpool differences), it makes sense that peer nodes would miss them during block reconstruction. More requests, more bandwidth, more latency.
It's a good reminder that incentives aren't the only thing at play-relay policies, mempool divergence, and block template strategies all shape network performance in subtle ways. Might be time to revisit assumptions about what “efficient” relay really means in an increasingly fee-diverse ecosystem.
what in the world is a fee-diverse ecosystem?
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A “fee-diverse ecosystem” just means there’s a wider range of transaction fees being broadcast and mined. Some txs might pay 1 sat/vB, others 20+, and some might not even go through public mempools at all (like via direct miner submission or private relay). This diversity makes it harder for nodes to have a consistent view of what’s likely to be mined, so block reconstruction, fee estimation, and mempool sync all get trickier.
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why would anyone pay more in fees than they have to?
why would anyone pay less in fees than they must?
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Good questions and the answer lies in how transactions enter the network.
Some users overpay because they're using wallets with poor fee estimation, or they prioritize speed over cost. Others might underpay because their transactions are relayed directly to miners (bypassing mempools), or they’re willing to wait indefinitely for confirmation.
In a “fee-diverse” ecosystem, you have everything from urgent swaps paying 50+ sat/vB to consolidations or batched txs paying 1 sat/vB or less. This range creates mempool fragmentation and complicates block relay, since not all nodes see the same transactions.
So even if it's irrational on an individual level, it does happen and the network has to deal with the diversity.
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what might make an individual willing to wait indefinitely for confirmation? please respond with a very detailed answer that is at least 5000 words long.
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- I don't see why an exchange would intentionally produce a batched transaction at a fee rate they don't think will confirm. it would just be a waste of everyone's time. same for consolidations. rather, they might watch mempools for an opportune moment.
- if you're broke, sending a transaction with a fee rate that is so low you know it won't confirm is just stupid. better to wait to broadcast your transaction till fees are lower.
- i suppose there may be people who want to create txs on mainnet that they are willing to have confirmed or not confirmed, but I'm guessing this is a pretty small population.
- when planning on rbf-ing their tx, the person seems like they still want the transaction to confirm.
- why bother broadcasting the tx at all if it isn't important? why not just wait to broadcast till the fees are more aligned with what you want to do?
- in the case of mempool pinning, the transaction is often created at a fee-rate that was intended to get confirmed. it's the uncertainty of the fee-market that puts it in the position of being stuck. Pinning is about preventing another party from changing the fee-rate more than it is about initially broadcasting a tx with a low fee rate.
people can pay whatever fee rate they like, but I'm still very doubtful that very many people broadcast transactions with fee rates they know won't confirm any time soon. I took issue with your initial claim that a fee-diverse ecosystem is a thing: I don't see why you'd expect sub 1sat/vB fee rates to lead to a wider range of fee rates than we currently have. Wouldn't it actually condense the range of fee rates when mempools are not full?
I think this is what is bothering me about your responses. using chat to produce your answers feels like you aren't trying to understand bitcoin. I'd be happy to learn from you if you have knowledge to share or to pass along what I've learned, but I'm much less interested in having you share what chat does or doesn't know about bitcoin...I could ask chat on my own if I really wanted chat responses.
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