Example of high Muun fees \ stacker news ~bitcoin

Example of high Muun fees

698 sats \ 22 comments \ @ek 29 Dec 2022 bitcoin

Regarding #110731, @02425e252d

Paying Muun invoices

Phoenix -> Muun: 262 sat

WoS -> Muun: 75 sat

BlueWallet -> Muun: 301 sat

Using Muun to pay invoices

Muun -> Phoenix (onchain): 346 sat

Muun -> Bitrefill: 209 sat

Muun -> CoinGate: 210 sat

Muun -> Phoenix: 178 sat

Other wallets

Phoenix -> BlueWallet: 26 sat

Phoenix -> WoS: 57 sat

view all related items

10 sats \ 2 replies \ @poe7645 29 Dec 2022

Honestly been having the same problem with Phoenix which everyone says to switch to. A 100 sat payment costs about 2 sats. But if I send 70,000 sats (about $10) the fee was 392 sats. I can do on chain payments for less. Muun has never cost me over 3 sats for similar payments.

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @ek OP 29 Dec 2022

Who are you sending to?

And who are you sending to using Muun?

1 sat \ 0 replies \ @poe7645 29 Dec 2022

I've been playing some more. Muun to Phoenix for 70,000 was 3 sats... the first time

Phoenix back to Muun was 392 sats

Then I downloaded wallet of Satoshi I sent 50,000 both to Phoenix and WoS Pheonix was 172 sats WoS was 429 sats...

I sent 20,000 sats from Phoenix to WoS for sats. I sent the entire balance from WoS to Phoenix for 47 sats. And now I'm running into a problem where Phoenix fails payments about 80% of the time over 10,000 sats back to WoS and costs about 7-8 sats per transaction.

I also sent a couple 40,000 sat tx from WoS to both muun and Phoenix and both cost one was 4 and one was 7 sat fees.

I want to like Phoenix but the failed transactions I've been having since really digging in and not knowing what the fee will be, with wild swings in fees, until after it is sent is kinda of putting me off.

I guess I just need to play around more. But yes I am encountering the high fee on muun as well so I'm not hell bent on defending anything. Just burning sats experimenting.

0 sats \ 3 replies \ @firedev 29 Dec 2022

So what’s the alternative for the iPhone? Oh actually there is a post #112860

0 sats \ 2 replies \ @ek OP 29 Dec 2022

Anything else basically.

I use Phoenix but Blue Wallet also seems to be decent. If you don't care about custody, Wallet of Satoshi seems to be nice.

See https://darthcoin.substack.com/p/lightning-wallets-comparison

When I got my LN node running, I will use a LN node wallet

3 sats \ 1 reply \ @firedev 29 Dec 2022

Thanks! I just want something frictionless like Muun

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @ek OP 29 Dec 2022

You are a sovereign individual. You can use custodial. But consider yourself warned haha:

The Wallet of Satoshi, while easy to use, is a custodial wallet. This means that you don’t actually have control over your sats. Should The Wallet of Satoshi company collapse due to some market contagion, you can be prepared to kiss your previous Bitcoin goodbye.

From the post you linked

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @tlindi 29 Dec 2022

Not your node, not your rules. Why to whine?

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @notgeld 29 Dec 2022

We also have high fees in Valet because we consider its LN-Fiat-Channels features as spending feature for casual usage.

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.btcontract.walletfiat

We do it for Fiat channels and thus, it is always a percent of fiat-denominated payments.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @benthecarman 29 Dec 2022

Muun has high fees because it isn't a lightning wallet, all "lightning" transactions actually are 2 on-chain transactions. I would recommend not using the wallet

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @muteness11 29 Dec 2022

I stopped using MUUN due to its shaddy on-chain tx fees .... its quite high

0 sats \ 2 replies \ @Hermit 29 Dec 2022

Muun -> WoS : 0 Sats

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @ek OP 29 Dec 2022

Interesting. Can you try 50k sats?

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @ek OP 29 Dec 2022

I noticed I can try myself lol

Muun -> WoS: 0 sats using 10k invoice

Muun -> WoS: 232 sats using 50k invoice

Well ... guess even Muun realizes that paying 200 sats for 10k sats would be quite high with 2%. So they just pay the onchain fee themselves?

0 sats \ 5 replies \ @BITC0IN 29 Dec 2022

muun is NOT a lightning wallet https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/zxee9g/bitcoin_sucks/

20 sats \ 0 replies \ @ek OP 29 Dec 2022

Yeah, that was another motivation to make this post and show everyone how high the fees are compared to other, actual LN wallets.

1 sat \ 3 replies \ @ama 29 Dec 2022

Not only it isn't a LN wallet, but it also defeats all the purposes of the LN, like scalability and immediate settlement, by unnecessarily using block space to simulate actual LN transactions. It can't be done worse, or will they in the next version? If someone can, they are, that's for sure.

0 sats \ 2 replies \ @ek OP 29 Dec 2022

I like your toxicity regarding Muun compared to the thread about nostr 😂

But yeah, I agree!

37 sats \ 1 reply \ @ama 29 Dec 2022

Well... one of them is an incredible protocol that has the potential to do what Bitcoin does for money to, basically, most everything else online, whereas the other is a disgusting piece of shhhh... "code" that perverts and defeats the purpose of the beautiful LN. I react to them accordingly, don't you think? 😂

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @ek OP 29 Dec 2022

Yeah, makes sense haha

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @timechain 29 Dec 2022

Well, theres a reason for that.

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @ek OP 29 Dec 2022

Is it just coincidence that a "LN payment" using Muun costs around an onchain transaction (200+ sats)? The world wonders....