By James Bovard
The latest killing of a protester in Minneapolis by federal agents is reminiscent of the shooting of Vickie Weaver by a government sniper in 1992. In both cases, the government has refused to acknowledge wrongdoing and has engaged in legal coverups.
Hmm...maybe on the coverups, the the severity of the gov action is very different for those 2 situations.
Showing up to the middle of a police action while armed and being shot during a scuffle is very different than your wife walking outside her house and getting shot by a sniper.
Yes, indeed. Not to minimize what happened but there is a significant difference. One happened on private property and the other on so-called public.
I believe this is the significant point of similarity to the author. The right is not supposed to think that simply being armed warrants being killed.
I guess my cynical view is being exposed here. There is no way I would enter a situation like this one with a deadly weapon without expecting to be killed. If I were pulled over by police and I had one of my arms in the car I would be thinking first about how to not trigger the state agent to kill me.
Even in that situation I am very aware of the likelihood of being killed. It's just the reality will live in. The police have protections we simply do not. It's wrong and immoral and illogical. I'm not excusing this killing. I am simply annoyed that there are people encouraging fools to do things that will get them killed.
I say fools because what else can you call someone that begs the state to force everything they desire and yet acts like this monster they feed will not eat them as soon as they cross it. The people acting like driving a vehicle into an active police action will not result in a shooting should think long and hard about deadly force.
If you cross the state, you'd better be prepared. The Ruby Ridge people understood that better than most. Most people that have taken training on how to conceal carry will know why these people are dead. It's not a question of justification to me. It's not justified in this recent case at least. It's a question of reality. The reality is that the state agents can and will kill you. Be prepared.
What is really going on here is terrible management and its gonna hurt Trump terribly. Regardless of this law this looks terrible. Regardless of my political views this seems like a terrible way to deport people. It's incompetence.
I have been critical of policing policies for well over a decade now. BLM did a terrible job after the killing of Floyd. Now Trump's people are screwing this up.
Mob rule prevails again in Minneapolis
I support drug legalization. I am going to interfere with DEA operations. Who will join me?
I support the right of every state to refuse to work with the federal government. But the state in question isn't a believer in that.
If I were Trump I'd cut all fed money to them and withdraw. I do no live there. If they wanna do these things that is on them.
This is all a game being player by two sides. There aren't ideological people at the top.
Exactly. If they want to thumb their noses at the feds, more power to them, but they can do so without federal funds.
This should be the real solution not more ICE boots on the ground but the corruption and the stealing is so prevalent on both sides they will never cut off the cash
TACO
As usual we agree. I'm not arguing with anyone saying it was stupid for him to be there and to be armed, but I do want to offer the reminder that they shouldn't be justifying it.
We are drowning in hypocrisy my friend.
First off, I'd never enter this area period. Forget being armed.
TLDR;
I agree with you.
But most on the right and most 2A people are clueless about being armed around police and the risk. The police, for the most part do not want you armed when they are around.
This is a massive area of ignorance on the right. The back the blue crowd. The blue boot will be on your neck my friend.
I don't think all cops are evil but it's a system full of corruption and bad incentives.
I usually caution people to regard cops as they would any other large dangerous mammal. Give them a wide berth and avoid attracting their attention.
A bear will usually leave you alone, but why risk it?
Yep.
Correct. They have made that point rather strongly in every other circumstance.
Remember how the left cried out about the killing? Me neither. This is a root issue. I mean, many on the right cheered on the state as well. Same goes for Waco.
If Ashley Babbitt was shot unarmed, how is this any different? Same rules should apply
Yeah, it was wrong then and it's wrong now. That is applying the same rules.
Remember the outrage from the left over that. Remember how they said these people were just protesting?
I don’t value democracy though
https://twiiit.com/palmerluckey/status/2013831417923567812
I often wonder, how useful is it really to call out peoples' logical and moral inconsistencies? There surely are principled people out there, but it seems to me that most are not, and when the principled people call out the unprincipled people for their hypocrisy, it's like speaking into the wind.
And, my suspicion is that the principled people know this. So why do it? What do you think?
I'm usually with you. I finally caved today and engaged with a bunch of bad anti-libertarian takes on this stuff. Probably won't amount to much, but I also find it annoying seeing this stuff go unchallenged.
I do think there's utility in making the counterpoint visible. In that sense calling out the inconsistencies is not for the sake of the hypocrite. It's for the onlooker trying to make sense of an issue.
Makes sense that it's mostly for onlookers
I think personally I'm just exhausted by it. Been preferring more to withdraw from arguments rather than engage
I feel that too.
I think my (our) drive to logical consistency is an innate characteristic. And as such it can be used to control me. The vast majority of people I have encountered only have logic when it benefits them.
Only reason I engage here is that usually the disagreement is educational.
I've mostly chosen withdrawal, lately. Finally got triggered today.
Principles are determined by the victors
The only principle that matters is winning
Yeah... that's not a good path.
It's also false
For one thing it is anti-Christ. Which matters more than anything else to me.
Yeah... I resemble this remark.
I guess this Pretti guy has zero social media footprint
Was he on the private signal chat group?