Introducing the new Phoenix: a 3rd generation self-custodial Lightning wallet \ stacker news ~bitcoin

Introducing the new Phoenix: a 3rd generation self-custodial Lightning wallet acinq.co/blog/phoenix-splicing-update

7195 sats \ 35 comments \ @Norbert 11 Jul 2023 bitcoin

1676 sats \ 12 replies \ @nerd2ninja 11 Jul 2023

While you were making Bitcoin banks, Phoenix scripted out lightning channel management

While LND was making shitcoins on Bitcoin, Phoenix was implementing splicing

While you were making DNS addresses for lightning zaps, Phoenix was working on bolt 12

When the custodial rug pulls and rehypothecation comes, when the government attack strike down, when the lightning shitcoins lose speculative value, only Phoenix wallet users will be ready. For it spent its time improving the protocol

https://primal.net/thread/note1n8j639au0n8hjhupe9j4u0ar3p8lza436g3dv0zmvhkhjfjg6qrs08fy8x

150 sats \ 0 replies \ @wrangler 11 Jul 2023

Lol, pretty much sums it up. And what’s coming next is pretty awesome too:

What's next?

Blinded paths: better privacy for your Lightning payments BOLT 12/Offers: static Lightning invoices Taproot: cheaper channel management and better on-chain privacy

150 sats \ 0 replies \ @pepetrueno 11 Jul 2023

Phoenix is killing it, and keeping their model sustainable for the future. good job for them :)

50 sats \ 6 replies \ @KoreaComK 11 Jul 2023

I've always liked and used Phoenix, I just stopped using it in recent months because I had a problem with my VPN and my device, which by the way was resolved and now I'm going to use it again (I never delete the app). I've always advised people to use the Phoenix, but many prefer the Wallet of Satoshi or the freak Muun. Unfortunately many people prefer costal solutions that spend less satoshis than non-custodial solutions.

51 sats \ 0 replies \ @nerd2ninja 11 Jul 2023

0 sats \ 2 replies \ @muteness11 12 Jul 2023

is it true that their fee tx is 1%?

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @KoreaComK 12 Jul 2023

only if it is necessary to open a channel

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @nerd2ninja 12 Jul 2023

Per the article they wrote, they're changing it to routing fees only and those fees are 0.4% which is something I'm already seeing complaints about. It is open source code however, so if someone would like to compete with them, please fork the codebase and do so.

Also, please learn about eltoo and channel factories. It requires a softfork and softforks require consensus, which means it needs you to learn about it, agree with it, and pass the word on.

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @Dash_1971 12 Jul 2023

What problem did you have with VPN? I am also having a problem I can't connect back to my node using Phoenix and I suspect playing around with the VPN split tunnel settings caused it.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @KoreaComK 12 Jul 2023

My problem was due to my phone operator, not necessarily my wallet. As my plan is prepaid, they block VPN when I'm using 4G.

20 sats \ 2 replies \ @shibe 12 Jul 2023

I like Phoenix but they still haven't addressed the biggest issue: you can only open channels with ACINQ. Considering ACINQ is based in the EU/France, it's possible they could be the target of regulation in the future. Imagine for example hundreds of thousands of people get onboarded onto Phoenix only for ACINQ to suddenly require KYC or blacklist certain nodes. At that point the Phoenix app will just be a paperweight and it could take months/years to move users to a new wallet (that likely doesn't have the same ease of use as Phoenix)

110 sats \ 0 replies \ @nerd2ninja 12 Jul 2023

https://github.com/ACINQ/phoenix

The power of the entire codebase in the palm of your hand

100 sats \ 0 replies \ @snakedye 12 Jul 2023

Even if you had the option to open channels with other nodes, most people would still use ACINQ's nodes. So you would have to also make them migrate. Whether or not you can only open channels with ACINQ is irrelevant to the issue you underlined because the solution is the same anyway. Force close or just sent your funds to another wallet. I don't even think it's an issue. If you don't like what they're doing you have the keys. Bounce.

331 sats \ 1 reply \ @ae52f929c 11 Jul 2023

I consider my knowledge on LN introductory. Where can I learn more about all this new terminology I see popping up surrounding LN? I don't have any social media. Now there is splicing, single dynamic channels and all kinds of stuff. Things are developing so fast I feel like I am struggling to keep up. I guess I am just a base layer boomer!

511 sats \ 0 replies \ @TonyGiorgio 11 Jul 2023

https://lightningsplice.com/

121 sats \ 1 reply \ @0xIlmari 11 Jul 2023

Exciting. I wonder if existing channels will be consolidated by ACINQ actively or opportunistically (i.e. only when there is a need for an on-chain operation).

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @jk_14 12 Jul 2023

I hope the last one. I have old, big enough channel, never needed bigger (no new channel creation so far) - and I rather prefer to use it still in old style, with lower LN fees

121 sats \ 2 replies \ @nerd2ninja 11 Jul 2023

I have never been more excited to be a Pheonix wallet user!

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @muteness11 12 Jul 2023

is it true that their tx fee is 1%? .... what are your thoughts as a user on UX? pros/cons?

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @ek 18 Jul 2023

only for opening new channels

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @leo 12 Jul 2023

This is really great. But what's still missing in Phoenix is to "buy" or "choose" how much inbound capacity you want to have. Imagine in the splicing scenario, I download Phoenix and want to start accepting payments for my ice cream stand.

The way Phoenix works today is that for each ice cream I sell, I get an additional channel and have to pay a 1% fee. That sucks! In the splicing model, My channel gets bigger with every Lightning payment I receive, but I still have to pay the onchain fees for every such payment. In the end I have a usable channel, but still spent a ton of sats on onchain fees.

100 sats \ 1 reply \ @nicosey 12 Jul 2023

No new opt code or moaning about bitcoin needs to change. These guys just ship...

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @nerd2ninja 13 Jul 2023

Well people do still complain about fees and their fees could be lower....if we had channel factories. Ah but that would require a soft fork

100 sats \ 0 replies \ @kepford 11 Jul 2023

Love what these folks are doing.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @0252629714 21 Jul 2023

0.4 Percent, thats toooo expensive.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @oraltosun 12 Jul 2023

I'll definetely check it out.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @2bithits 12 Jul 2023

Will it be a new app or just an update?

Will it need a new channel opened or old ones ok?

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @ursuscamp 11 Jul 2023

This is extremely exciting. Will there be a way to migrate existing channels to the new splicing channel model?

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @KoreaComK 11 Jul 2023

Phoenix is an excellent wallet. It was my first lightning wallet that I downloaded in mid-2020.