How can we make Bitcoin more "physical"?
1886 sats \ 18 comments \ @birdeye21 26 Jul 2023 bitcoin
I was just reading about how frustrated someone was about in person restaurants/stores that don't accept cash.
While not about the cash, this resonated with me because of how much I hate QR menus.
I came to a restaurant for a physical, real life experience, so why aren't we embracing that? For the sake of printer ink savings??
I know Bitcoin can be stored in all kinds of various physical devices, but how practical do you see this form of transacting Bitcoin being in the long run?
Projects like the Bolt Card are working on this, but it still requires a traditional POS, unlike physical cash.
Are there better ways to make Bitcoin more cash-like, psychically speaking?
Could we store Bitcoin in paper cash? Or will it just be cash that we spend physically until mobile devices are more widespread globally?
Would ~ half of the world benefit from something like this? Or will we all just end up paying with our devices via LN? (and eventually our neuralink chips of course)
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80 sats \ 0 replies \ @garyKrause_ 26 Jul 2023
We make bitcoin more physical by in person engagement and fellowship. Be a physical social node and connect with other nodes. Help spin sup new nodes.
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58 sats \ 0 replies \ @mudbloodvonfrei 26 Jul 2023
Dude... sats card from coinkite. Affordable, great form factor. I've been playing around with them lately. It's essentially an NFC-enabled hardware wallet that you use as cash because the private key can't be read without causing a physical change on the memory slot that can be detected by the app, so the receiver is reasonably sure that you don't have a backup.
I had a post about this recently with some helpful comments.
satscard.com
They have some very cool designs but if you want to keep costs down the simplest one is $7
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38 sats \ 4 replies \ @nerd2ninja 26 Jul 2023
You're basically trying to figure out how to make a secret into something physical. Sure you can pass a plate with the secret written on it, but how do you know that the secret has been kept secret since its been passed around?
Someone tried to solve this using a multi-sig scheme, but it required trust from the issuer which is the exact problem we're trying to get away from here.
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10 sats \ 1 reply \ @021e1f393f 26 Jul 2023
Yes we can solve this, for example, there is irreversible photochromic ink. Irreversible photochromic ink is a type of ink that changes color when exposed to UV light, but the color change is permanent and cannot be reversed, this can be used so paper bitcoin can trade hands but once someone scans and take it back to its wallet then it means that qr code no longer works.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @nerd2ninja 27 Jul 2023
That doesn't solve for the fact that someone or some information system has knowledge of the private key and has to have knowledge of the private key in order to record it on the note in the first place.
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1 sat \ 1 reply \ @birdeye21 OP 26 Jul 2023
what's the multi sig scheme you're referring to?
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130 sats \ 0 replies \ @nerd2ninja 26 Jul 2023
Had to dig it up. Here you go: https://offline.cash/
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202 sats \ 0 replies \ @skreep_ 26 Jul 2023
would half the world benefit from something like this?
NO. Bitcoin is meant to be spent and moved digitally, not physical. Physical cash for Bitcoin is a stupid concept and a road that should not be entertained as worth trying to go down.
Passing around paper notes in exchange for Bitcoin will not work.
https://github.com/libbitcoin/libbitcoin-system/wiki/Reserve-Currency-Fallacy
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101 sats \ 2 replies \ @021e1f393f 26 Jul 2023
I had this problem in el salvador, lets point some of the flaws of CryptoCurrencys over physical cash:
  1. old people are displaced, I learned how to use lightning by necessity because i forced myself to bring about only 40$ of cash however it was a pain for me because that ended quickly and people would tell me just use an atm, sorry that isn't a good solution and in the end i didn't use it, first atms are kyc and also they steal like 5 to 8% of your value going from bitcoin to fiat, the point of bitcoin is to get rid of Fiat not for a mixed world.
  2. the complexity of the whole operation is too complex, both people require to know what is bitcoin, what is a layer 2, what is lightning, how lightning works, that lightning is not as safe as bitcoin base layer, that both persons have smartphones and both have internet, this whole operation looks almost like a ritual and its basically absurd and retarded, now cash is king because you just give the physical paper of 5$ to the other person and they are happy, or you just give 5 coins worth 1$ each and both persons are happy, its elegant, its simple.
  3. I hope ctv comes earlier than later, i know the most pure maxis are in their own church we are the first coin, we are the only one decentralized, we are the only ones with no ico etc however that doesn't matter if the competition steps up and eventually wins more users even if they are more centralized garbage, in reality there is space for only one coin and if vitalik manages to fix etherium flaws which i doubt but he will then we will be living in a world where a POS shitcoin controled by jpmorgan dominates the infrastructure of the future of the internet.
  4. Lets say some of the original founders of bitcoin, lets give a random number 1000 bitcoins, locks those 1000 bitcoins in a smart contract then we can print physical bitcoin.
  5. we need to standarize how qr codes are going to work because sure physical bitcoin can be printed on paper or even wood or metals with 3d printers but all the qr codes ideally look the same so it looks serious and not confusing.
  6. money is information, bitcoin is information, qr codes are the physical manifestation of information in a language computers can understand.
  7. the qr codes need to be divisible, if you split a qr code in half it no longer works however lets say we print one big qr code with the value of 100,000 satoshis then you should be able to cut the qr code with a scissor and then have 10 smallers qr codes with a value of 10,000 satoshis each.
  8. the person with physical bitcoin now its able at any time able to scan and reclaim their satoshis, i suppose every qr code should have an expiration date.
Hopefully someone reads this, i hope i can picture to you how we need to win the war against fiat money, when roman disappeared people hundreds of years later still used the silver denarius, we cannot afford a future where people still use the dollar after the dolar fails we need to displace the dollar with an active force and replace it with a superior form of money.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @llamabyte 27 Jul 2023
qr codes are not a solution for physical bitcoin on their own. You do not want you money to be able to be stolen from a random camera snooping around.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @llamabyte 27 Jul 2023
Monero fixes all that. try it. Super easy to use loooow fees. It the silver to bitcoins gold.
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20 sats \ 1 reply \ @elvismercury 26 Jul 2023
Open dime from Coinkite is great for this very reason. Interesting how much the physical object means at a deep level.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @mudbloodvonfrei 27 Jul 2023
They came out with satscard recently. Seems like a better (10 slots so reusable after sweeping the wallet, and a better form factor) and cheaper ($7)
It's fascinating to see the psychological aspects of money. I carry a satscard with a small amount on it, and it just feels right.
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20 sats \ 0 replies \ @BITC0IN 26 Jul 2023
satscards and opendimes are another option
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @hynek 27 Jul 2023
Have a look on Lotes idea https://github.com/hynek-jina/lotes
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @SpaceHodler 27 Jul 2023
Physical BTC notes could work, but they'd have to be redeemable for real BTC and you'd have to guarantee the redemption burns them / removes them from circulation.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @llamabyte 27 Jul 2023
spend 30 years trying to make money digital spend 11 years keeping it decentralized
all we want is centralized physical money
lol
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @faithandcredit 26 Jul 2023
Kraken Bux
A note that cannot be easily counterfeit that is redeemable for x amount of BTC on demand (At kraken -you have to withdraw after that if you want)
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