Here are some tweets I just saw:
I know Liquid is not perfect, but I think it can be beneficial in some use cases. What are your thoughts on this?
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Here are some tweets I just saw:
I know Liquid is not perfect, but I think it can be beneficial in some use cases. What are your thoughts on this?
Interesting idea. Same could be said for the Lightning Network too. Expensive mempool fees push all kinds of scaling ideas to the forefront.
Typical shitcoinery. A multi-sig between a bunch of companies is perfect for their scams.
Just keep informing the innocent on what their play is: an exit event
well said. Here is my point on Liquid
I forgot that clip. Saying the quiet part out loud. Very important reminder. Thanks. Have some sats.
OK, now Strike is apparently looking into it:
https://m.stacker.news/7719
Fee pressure needs solutions
This is why I don't mind ordinals/inscriptions. Solutions to high fees pop up when there's fee pressure. Happens every time.
Bull Bitcoin in Canada has for yeaaars
If the jpeg fans want to run wild on Liquid, have at it.
Unfortunately, I don't think that's what's happening. It looks to me that the jpeggers are forcing legitimate transactions to liquid to avoid the high fees.
Working exactly as intended then.
Ah shit
That's too bad.
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There's something weird going on with some of those charts. Liquid's max block size is 4mb, just like bitcoin's. But those charts show blocks as more than half full when they only have 200kb of data in them. They should be showing them as 1/20th full.
Even if those transactions weren't using the segwit discount (which they are), liquid blocks still have room for up to 1mb of undiscounted data, so 200kb of undiscounted data should still display as less than 1/4 full.
But inscriptions, lightning channels, and submarine swaps all use the segwit discount, so I wonder if mempool.space is doing something extra sneaky to make the blocks look like they have more activity in them than they really do.
Anybody from team @Mempool here to explain 🤔 😅 ?
Either way. It is seeing increased usage. Posted on Twitter abit ago about it.
The Current State of Bitcoin Sidechains (By Network Usage)
To be as fair as possible. (Since each chain has different block times) I went from Bitcoin block 820725 (7:56 PST) to block 820738 (10:08 PST) and pulled all the equivalent TXs for each chain.
Transactions (over 2 hour period) Bitcoin: 49,533 Liquid: 1124 Rootstock: 989 Stacks: 779
One caveat* This includes coinbase TX's. So you could remove 72 Liquid TXs, 144 Rootstock, and 12 Stacks block to make this more balanced.
And is there any guestimate....no matter how wild.... how Lightning Network would fit in there?
I'd have to look back through the River report on Lightning.
Lightning numbers are WAY WAY higher than these.
I've always been bullish on Liquid.
Liquid is fine don’t keep your life savings on there I think the idea of stacking tiny utxos and then pegging out on chain when fees are reasonable is a solid plan to protection your stack from getting eaten up by miners
Yes, even though many complain about the "federated" nature of Liquid. For many cases its fine....I mean vendors themselves expose you to counter-party risk (ie. you send your btc to buy something and they never ship your goods, etc).
So, using Liquid as something like a "purchasing network" might not increase your risk by any appreciable amount. Obviously the risk that is present, is managed by sizing your peg-in to not put more than you can stand to lose.
With wallets like Green that has BTC, LN, and Liquid its basically an existing solution that just needs discovery.
There is also the matter of "Assets" that Liquid supports (yes, I know....shitcoin factory). However there are tons of legit commercial uses for Assets...imagine your "shopper reward points" (airline miles, etc). I would frankly feel safer if my Airline Miles were held on a federated chain rather than held by a single entity.
liquid is better than some custodial wallets that are being promoted around here.
Yea, it's also a significant improvement over holding coins on an exchange, which most people seem happy to do anyway.
Great answer!
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Juraj Bednar has published interesting article about this topic months ago: https://juraj.bednar.io/en/blog-en/2023/05/07/expanding-the-lightning-network-to-serve-billions-a-quick-win-strategy/
But I still don't like liquid. Mainly because you cannot simply switch it into real bitcoin.. It's not for end users...
You can use Sideswap to quickly peg out or Boltz to swap into mainnet or lightning.
We just need a muun-like wallet where we can have some funds on liquid and be able to pay lightning invoices with it. Something like that will be a way better option than a custodial wallet for newcomers, After the users stack some sats, they can save them on a hw on the bitcoin blockchain. I guess with the arrival of fedimint we will have some kind of solution like that too.
I believe new Aqua wallet will launch with the functionality you're describing. https://twitter.com/AquaBitcoin
I would assume some of that volume is retail looking for cheaper transactions and arb traders using it to move between supporting exchanges, who knows it could force more exchanges to adopt it along with LN so maybe that is the benefit of ordinals finally getting traction on scaling solutions which will bring liquidity and more development
They aint using liquid...no one is
https://m.stacker.news/7711
Transactions (over 2 hour period) Bitcoin: 49,533 Liquid: 1124 Rootstock: 989 Stacks: 779
Everytime fees go up people say this and it never happens. Fedimint will be launching soon which is similar to liquid but 1000x better
Ben can you explain in a sentence or two the 1000x improvement that fedi provides over something like liquid...in your opinion. Ty ty
Liquid is just a federated version of bitcoin, it has a couple other op codes and confidential transactions, but offers no real architecture improvements.
Fedimint is an ecash based mint, so it actually leverages the benefits of federated custody and isn't just another blockchain.
It's harder to audit a fedimint federation and the use-case seems more oriented towards simple transfers. I wouldn't say fedimint is 1000x better, it just has different advantages and tradeoffs. I also think covenants and confidential amounts on liquid are pretty distinguishing features.
Fedimint offers better privacy and more programability than liquid
Yeah the ability to audit is traded for privacy. And programmability in what way? The fedimint modules with server side components run and executed by guardians? I like fedimint for the ability to create and choose federations but there are tradeoffs.
Yes the modules, rust code is way more expressive and easier than bitcoin script even with covenants
the auditability is really the only one
Is there a way to fix the auditability problem? Or is there anything on the roadmap?
Can you send to cold storage your coins with Fedimint?
of course
Cool!
There are bonds in El salvador made from Liquid
Its good to have some for high fee environments. I wouldn't say that ordinals saved liquid though. 9 transactions in a block is hardly much
Use the tools wisely. Let' say you need LN inbound capacity as you stacked hard on Robosats witn Non-KYC BTC and you channel is full. You can swap out to L-BTC with boltz.exchange, stack harder with LN and should fees be lower again, swap L-BTC to BTC cold storage or swap L-BTC back to LN. Know you options!
I need to use liquid
So, you saying Adam Back is behind all the ordinals spam?
people here say a lot of shit, just ignore what is irrelevant.
oh snap, I forgot the
/sIt will be interesting to see if this causes an increase in BTCUSD. If this is good for price appreciation then we are very supportive of sidechains. Right now, it appears sodechains reduce block space demand by moving transactions off chain, so this could be seen as causing less demand for block space. This is bad bad.
It def has!
With the recent spike in Liquid usage we managed to give you a rare glimpse inside Blockstream HQ
https://nitter.net/seedor_io/status/1734547234790797567
Liquid = Shitcoin
Don't use liquid (shitcoin), Its hard to convert from liquid (shitcoin) to real bitcoin (liquidity is low)!
Side swap for pegging in and out
Or boltz swap
i downloaded a liquid wallet once
Has no one figured out that Liquid is a blockchain and if it becomes the Amazon S3 of Jpegs its fees will go up!
yes
I doubt if L-BTC is greater than Lightning