Expensive fridges are dying young. Owners are suing, claiming fraud \ stacker news ~tech

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Expensive fridges are dying young. Owners are suing, claiming fraud www.nbcbayarea.com/investigations/consumer/expensive-fridges-dying-fraud-claims/3428989/

6185 sats \ 27 comments \ @beorange 22 Jan tech

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1425 sats \ 10 replies \ @Turdinthepunchbowl 22 Jan

Vance Packard - Waste Makers wrote about planned obsolescence back in 1960. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Waste_Makers

He was a man far ahead of his time when you look at some of the topics he wrote about. Here's an additional few to give an idea. Admittedly I haven't read all of his stuff, but feel many topics are still relevant today and do plan on reading at some point.

The Hidden Persuaders (1957) - about the advertising industry.

The Status Seekers (1959) - about social stratification and behavior.

The Naked Society (1964) - about how new technologies create threats to privacy. Seems one people here particularly would be interested in.

Our Endangered Children (1983) - about how America ignored the needs of future generation.

The Ultra Rich, How Much is Too Much (1989)

812 sats \ 0 replies \ @kepford 23 Jan

Yes, I was thinking of planned obsolescence but couldn't recall the name. Many things appear to be build as consumables. But, its not that simple. The products we buy, many of them at least keep adding more features but do not change much in price. How is this possible? Well some of it is due to technology advancements and some of it is due to companies that make components figuring out how to reduce costs. As someone that often repairs his own appliances and machines it has become harder and more expensive to do. Products are not made to be repairable. There isn't much market for it. Much bigger market for new and shiny. Some of this is due to propaganda I think (marketing) but much of it is due to fiat and the push to spend spend spend because of the melting ice cube of the fiat. Fiat is distorting the market on both ends. Producers and consumers.

587 sats \ 7 replies \ @kepford 23 Jan

Apple is a master of this planned obsolescence and making functional products look old. Ask yourself why they change their UI so often. They aren't just trying to make it better. I would argue it is more of akin to the fashion industry.

Many years ago when I was an avid Apple fan I was the odd ball. Now if you don't have the latest iPhone you are the odd ball weirdo. I'm fine with it but it is interesting to watch how the tribalism is affected by branding/marketing/propaganda. I don't think it is on accident at all.

30 sats \ 6 replies \ @WeAreAllSatoshi 23 Jan

I don’t necessarily disagree with what you’ve said, but I do think their support lifecycle for devices is quite good. As far as I can remember, Apple’s iPhone devices receive security updates and OS updates far longer than anything android. I think that probably argues against planned obsolescence at least a little bit.

100 sats \ 0 replies \ @kepford 23 Jan

Sorry, I should have communicated this more clearly. I am referring to their use of design ascetic. That's why I mention fashion. They do have decent support regarding security updates and OR upgrades.

0 sats \ 4 replies \ @aoeu 23 Jan

I had a Powerbook that used for about a decade. It was what I used up until my current M1 Pro MBP. Maybe Apple makes older functional products look old, but that could be because of the features on the newer models rather than a sinister programming to stop your older product from working.

0 sats \ 3 replies \ @kepford 23 Jan

I don't think they try to make things not work over time. I think they try to make things look old and out of vogue. Hence my analogy with fashion. I don't really view it as sinister. After all people can choose to buy other products. I think they want you buying new Apple products every few years whether you need them or not though. The term planned obsolescence triggers sinister conspiracy vibes. I don't think that is the case. I think its just how they compete. Fashion over function. They have some of the greatest designers in the world.

1 sat \ 0 replies \ @aoeu 23 Jan

That makes sense. I missed the fashion part/ design esthetic

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @clownworld 24 Jan

Well they did get sued for slowing down older model iPhones on purpose. They were forced to stop it.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @aoeu 24 Jan

That's true but the stated reason for slowing down older models was because degraded batteries caused issues with reliability of the phone. This process still happens now but I think there is at least a message that pops up telling you what is happening and you have the option to turn that feature off. The fine was for making that software change without alerting the user.

100 sats \ 0 replies \ @kr 22 Jan

hadn’t heard of him before, great reco!

995 sats \ 9 replies \ @kepford 22 Jan

Fiat at work.

43 sats \ 8 replies \ @kr 22 Jan

i’m not so sure it’s as simple as that.

elon has managed to build a total tank of a pickup truck, surely some entrepreneur could build a tank of a fridge and steal a bunch of market share from all the bland, faceless brands that are allergic to innovation and QA testing.

571 sats \ 2 replies \ @kepford 22 Jan

I'm not convinced Elon could have built the things he has built without the fiat system and the market manipulation of the state.

But to your point there is more to it but a frig is a utility device. The Tesla is very different. Its built for the wealthy and "green" conscience. Its also trendy and kitchen appliances are not.

My theory is that due to monetary inflation the cost of making things has increased and companies are striving to keep costs down by cutting corners. We know that for most mass market products price is a huge factor. There are exceptions like Apple and Tesla. Those to me are status brands. Not appliance companies. Not yet.

10 sats \ 1 reply \ @kr 23 Jan

yes, Elon’s DoE loan from 2008/2009 was very helpful (maybe necessary) for Tesla’s survival, but the latest set of ZEV credits don’t seem to have changed Tesla’s position as a profitable business.

Tesla continues to be profitable without them, and there remains a wide gap between Tesla and all other EV companies even though most other companies still have access.

I learned lots about state intervention from reading Americana, including that the Erie Canal the US steel industry both owe their existence to US subsidies in their earliest stage.

The Erie Canal was essential for settling the Great Lakes region, and the US steel industry in the Carnegie era couldn’t compete with imported British steel in a free market.

Both of those events occurred before the Federal Reserve was created.

451 sats \ 0 replies \ @kepford 23 Jan

This is a good point. Its not that the Fed is the central enemy. The central villain is the state. The US government stealing the money of people and deciding where it should be directed. The Fed is a more efficient mechanism than taxes. Corporations/Business interests aligned with governments doing as they please.

My issue is with the system of theft. Not people like Elon or even just the Fed. This belief that it is OK to steal from people just because you are a government. They exercise god like authority over the plebs.

451 sats \ 4 replies \ @kepford 23 Jan

Also there are many components that make up a fridge. With appliances the cost of repair is much higher than replacement. I would say that is largely due to fiat. So as a manufacturer it is more profitable for you to build with cheaper components. There are competing forces though. We have fiat currency inflation against technology advancement. I'm convinced tech advancement has greatly reduced the pain of inflation. So if the state continues to stifle innovation eventually it will be to much and kill the golden goose of tech.

10 sats \ 3 replies \ @kr 23 Jan

I suspect there are even more components in a pickup truck than in a fridge, but I agree that the relative cost of repair vs. replacement is definitely higher for a fridge.

I wonder if someone could succeed by building a “buy it for life” fridge that is essentially bulletproof, and use some of Elon’s marketing stunts from the Cybertruck launch to sell it.

570 sats \ 2 replies \ @kepford 23 Jan

Yeah no question. I know some people that work in the auto components industry and it is wild how much goes into making an automobile.

My guess on Elon is that he has no desire to make a "buy it for life" anything. Not under fiat I mean. Especially not as a publicly traded company. The fiat system pushes for short term financial gains. That is the other aspect that affects everything. Its more indirect but all of our time preferences are affected by the money used by society. Bad money. Bad incentives.

That's my thought at least for what its worth.

10 sats \ 1 reply \ @kr 23 Jan

yeah that’s fair, and i think you’re generally right that fiat tilts the world towards short-term goals over long-term ones… i wonder how many more bitcoiners need to exist before people start building products with extremely long time horizons.

451 sats \ 0 replies \ @kepford 23 Jan

My guess is a couple generations until we see a true trend reversal.

610 sats \ 0 replies \ @anon 23 Jan

Bought a Sub-Zero frig for a crazy amount of money in 2001 - not a single issue for 20 years. The 21st year it started loosing temperature. Contacted them direct - they sent out an authorized local repair tech. Full overhaul was needed - but Sub-Zero paid for 100% of the parts needed. I only had to pay for labor - well over a decade after the expired warranty. I was so impressed with their support that a few years later, when we purchased a new house, we installed a new Sub-Zero. So, there are some manufacturers that make good shit and stand behind it.

440 sats \ 0 replies \ @kr 22 Jan

we’re going backwards!

144 sats \ 1 reply \ @k00b 22 Jan

Is there a refrigerator equivalent to an analog gas stove?

I'm suspicious of luxury items for reasons like this. Fewer consumers usually means less feedback and less developed supply chains.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @OriginalSize 23 Jan

I've found everything luxury has a substantial portion of grift included. It's not a buy it for life segment. Maybe that's essential to it. If you can't afford 20k+2k/yr are you really rich enough for that fridge?

1 sat \ 0 replies \ @cyberpunk02 22 Jan

got to keep our old stuff going

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Roll 23 Jan

Do you know this story ?

a light buble works more than 100 years in a firehouse in San Francisco

https://centennialbulb.org/pic-favs.htm