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54 sats \ 3 replies \ @Signal312 OP 20h \ parent \ on: My friend is eating an almost vegetarian diet. I think it's killing him. HealthAndFitness

I'm not sure about "anecdotes don't count for much".

In the face of:

persistent, widespread denial of the damage that sugar and carbohydrates can do ¹.
persistent propaganda by mainstream media AGAINST eating meat, in particular beef... ²

...I almost trust anecdotes more than establishment science.

I have definitely run into people who (when I'm spouting off about my carnivore diet) tell me that they've been vegan and very healthy for 15 years. I'm not quite sure what to do with that information. Maybe they're not telling the truth, maybe they're vegetarian (plus dairy, eggs, fish) and calling that vegan, maybe they're doing an outstanding job at supplementing a deficient diet. Or maybe there are truly some people who do okay on a vegan diet.

All I know for absolute sure is how I've done with carnivore (SO much better, never going back), and a loved one on keto (tons better as well).

34 sats \ 2 replies \ @Undisciplined 20h

maybe there are truly some people who do okay on a vegan diet

This is where I'm at.

There are two diets that make no nutritional sense to me (carnivore and fruitarian) but I've met very healthy seeming people who did them for a long time. Maybe everything fell apart for them eventually, but I can't just assume that.

I've also known people whose health has gotten worse on various diets. I'm left with the conclusion that there's just a ton that we still don't know about nutrition.

42 sats \ 1 reply \ @Signal312 OP 18h

So you've actually seen long-term fruitarians? What is long term?

On the carnivore podcasts, one thing you hear very frequently is long term vegans, who have turned carnivore.

Here's what it usually looks like: their health issues just come to a breaking point, a friend who's a vegan-turned-carnivore encourages them to try it, they do, often have a VERY difficult time, emotionally, starting to eat meat again, but once they do, all their problems gradually disappear.

I've heard a variation of this story many, many times.

I'm curious if there's any version that go the other way....carnivore turned vegan.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Undisciplined 18h

I've met two fruitarians who claimed to be several years into it, both seemed healthy and one was very active and fit. I believe both of them but have no idea how that diet works.

I've heard that many carnivores start adding fruit back into their diets to deal with some health issues, but I don't recall what those were.

I don't know anyone who went vegan from carnivore, but I know lots of people whose health improved after going from meat heavy diets to vegetable and bean heavy diets. They mostly didn't stick with those diets, though, so I don't know much about long term ramifications. I'm also aware that there's a categorical difference between a meat-heavy American diet and an actual carnivore diet.

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