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So there is 'spam' onchain. I agree with that sentiment. And the 'going' rate for a basic transaction is 1 sat/vbyte or 17 cents
Currently there is ~1 block of transactions waiting 'in the mempool' at least above 1 sat/vbyte.
After that 'one block' (keep in mind, this is for all 8 billion people on Planet Earth) the next block is almost all sub 1-sat/vbyte transactions mostly consolidations of op_return 'things'.
Therefore.... ANY transactions at or above 1 sat/vbyte, be they for 5$ or 5 billion $ outbids EVERYTHING else spam included especially all 70 thousand waiting 'transactions' of it.
Here is a sample 'spam' transaction:
There are many like it:
And we can also see that ONE address is spamming these transactions, at really low fee rates by the THOUSANDS at a single time.
For example this address bc1pwhrx8gm0mmwg4fz2jyvma0cf2cjehdgeara9lqqh8j5e4nvedf5sq0gx2t is spamming junk/arbitrary data/op_return transactions by the thousands at a single time.
Why they are repeating the 'uncommon goods' datafield over and over... is beyond me. And as a matter of fact I don't see people talking about it / discussing it enough.
This is what the 'uncommon goods' op_return/token/rune "chart" looks like:
Why would 'any' actor keep paying 'real' money - Bitcoin - in order to pretend that a 'rune' exists and they can 'create' it by spamming the same transaction over and over?
I could understand if the chart for that memecoin was going 'up'... but there is a non-zero cost for spamming an output even at low fee rates and why it is being spammed is a mystery in my opinion that warrants more discussion.

In summary, I read on Twitter that "the filters are broken".
That "core is hostile".
That "jpegs have taken over" etc etc...
And regardless of what you make of these claims... I think they miss the fundamental, rational point to all of this...
Any transaction above 1 sat/vbyte or 17 cents transaction's fee outbids 99% OF THE SPAM...
Therefore "THE SPAM" isn't what's fundamentally broken, WE are.
The economic incentives to USE Bitcoin, to self-custody it, to transfer and ultimately exchange it for goods and services are overwhelming.
Therefore the LACK of demand to actually use Bitcoin, beyond ETFs even if JUST for savings in self custody does far more harm than 99% of the Spam does.
SPAM flourishes in apathy...
It grows with indifference.
And it reproduces as allowed by laziness...
Bitcoiners have to decide if they want to use Bitcoin or not, and then set the example for others.
Blaming others or 'Core' or "the Wizards" or "the taproot people" even Bitcoin Magazine is no excuse.
It's all on-chain, totally transparent, and there's no fooling anyone. The demand to use Bitcoin amongst the 8 billion people should be overwhelming.
Either we, with the knowledge to use Bitcoin, Set the Example or we don't.
So where is everyone?
Rarely transact on-chain. It's all LN now, even on here :)
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51 sats \ 1 reply \ @nout 18h
Maybe Lightning Network is too good and it needs to suck more.
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But it "doesn't work". And "Doesn't scale". And it "has failed".
Right.
That's why I was able to boost this post to the Top of Stacker News while drinking a cappuccino at a random cafe... non-custodially using my iPhone.
Lightning is great and we need more education as to what it and Bitcoin are imo
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44 sats \ 10 replies \ @OT 12 Aug
I will outbid these worms if I have to. Truth is that with LN you just don't need to use onchain that much.
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Lightning increased the number of people who can use Bitcoin by 100x. However that still means opening Lightning channels, and with 8 billion people, even 1% of which or 80 million using Lightning semi-regularly...
Blocks should be teeming with channel opens. Even .1% that's 8 million using Lightning regularly so blocks should be full from Lightning usage even if it's 100 transactions per one channel open.
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Many (most?) people use custodial lightning... so no channel openings, just updates in WoS database.
Does that still qualify as Bitcoin/Lightning?
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0 sats \ 4 replies \ @OT 13 Aug
Not in my book
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Exactly. So, we're still at very low LN adoption numbers, in your book.
(I do use WoS, Phoenix, Albyhub, coinos, and a few other custodial and non-custodial wallets, depending on my needs... but other than an occasional top up, I never had to open a channel beyond the moment I set up the wallet)
Even .1% that's 8 million using Lightning regularly so blocks should be full from Lightning usage even if it's 100 transactions per one channel open.
So, we're still very far from these numbers... including both "real" and "fake" LN users considerations in the equation.
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it's true: unless you have a sats flow that is unidirectional, mostly it's taking in sats and breathing them back out. One channel can last for a pretty long time.
I see the lack of fee-pressure as a sign that we aren't growing the user base of bitcoiners, not necessarily that the user base we have is apathetic.
So, we're still very far from these numbers... including both "real" and "fake" LN users considerations in the equation.
We'll get there eventually
Good point
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26 sats \ 1 reply \ @OT 13 Aug
I guess we don't have enough real bitcoiners yet.
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No we don't
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162 sats \ 1 reply \ @Scoresby 12 Aug
The ultimate filter is the bitcoiners who are using bitcoin and filling blocks with their economically meaningful transactions. Well said.
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The data in op_return isn't a problem. The block is the same size, a lower fee is better for all transactions, they have to pay more to put data there, and this doesn't violate any consensus rules. In my opinion, there's no problem here.
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I would agree. However there is a growing contingent of influencers, many of them well-meaning, accusing Core of malfeasance even misconduct or corruption with regards to Bitcoin... because they are "taking bribes" from the Spammers by "enabling spam" and "opening the shitcoin floodgates" (you see this alot on social media/X).
Like in 2017, they are saying the solution is to "run knots" which... doesn't make any sense to me. Low fee-rate transactions are getting through even though the vast majority of nodes filter them by default... the spam is getting through regardless of mempool policy and the filterers are only harming their own fee estimation.
In addition, the vast majority of the "spam" isn't jpegs... it's arbitrary data disguised as "tokens" usually in Witness script or op_return outputs. Anyone at any time can come up with any arbitrary way of including this data, any arbitrary schemes to "tokenize" data presented... just random 1s and 0s, It's a nuanced argument IMO and the "run knots" people aren't interested in nuance which doesn't help things.
Do they explain the risks involved in "running knots" or the tradeoffs? No. It's to "save Bitcoin" from the "evil Bitcoin Core" which doesn't make any sense to me.
Furthermore there is a technical deafness with regards to what is actually getting into mempools, what fees are being paid, and what the spam actually "is" which I think is wrong. A great benefit to Bitcoin is its transparency... actually examining what's in transactions and mempools and gaming/figuring that out over the next 25 years.
This post tried to take a guess at that and ask: Do People want to use Bitcoin or not?
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21 sats \ 1 reply \ @LibertasBR 12h
Do they explain the risks involved in "running knots" or the tradeoffs? No. It's to "save Bitcoin" from the "evil Bitcoin Core" which doesn't make any sense to me.
I completely agree with that. It's a clever approach to co-opting emotional people.
Everyone with knowledge should validate and verify the code to improve it and maintain its integrity. But the main point is to use Bitcoin as money. People using OpReturn for shit aren't a parameter; they'll always be there for that.
What needs to be done is to maintain transparency and consensus on code and each bitcoiner need to do their homework locally on this adoption.
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See #1079571 for my response...
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“Uncommon goods” is for losers. Inscriptions are for losers.
If UTXOs you control are linked to inscriptions, the world knows and knows you are a loser. That is all.
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I don't think Chinese (national) degens care. Which I don't really understand
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Do you have evidence that inscriptions are mostly being generated/purchased by Chinese Nationals? This is the first i've heard of it.
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I don't know why there hasn't been way more skepticism... about where exactly the spam and repetitive op_returns by the 10s of thousands have been coming from? It looks like degens in China/Asia
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I appreciate that info, it does appear to be the case.
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Good reminder I’m due to condense some UTXO’s
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10 sats \ 1 reply \ @dgy 22h
I do not understand why smart developers try to figure out how to make transaction even more efficient and on the other hand also enable more spamming?
Are they corrupt aka. having another hidden motive, are they cognitive delusional or are they some kind of neo luddites that want to protect further work as optimizing a dysfunctional UTXO set will be a challenging task that will occupy them for decades.
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I do not understand why smart developers try to figure out how to make transaction even more efficient and on the other hand also enable more spamming?
Developers... which developers? If you mean spammers... they are not developers. They are spammers. They are spamming "uncommon goods" op_returns by the thousands and thousands for reasons I don't understand. Usually at very low <1 sat/vb fee rates which take long periods to get confirmed.
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Bitcoiners have to decide if they want to use Bitcoin or not, and then set the example for others.
Indeed
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The obstruction of Bitcoin use for MoE is overwhelming. If you are prepared to break the law repeatedly you can conveniently use Bitcoin for MoE via LN or on chain, but very few people will and even fewer businesses are accepting. Otherwise in almost all jurisdictions you must record each and every transaction and the fiat price of bitcoin at the time of the transaction and calculate the CGs and tax due- a huge and impracticable obligation for any normal person. They have made lawful MoE use of Bitcoin for everyday transactions effectively impractical. The sly but very determined strategy of the fiat debt slavery bankers cartel to obstruct MoE into oblivion is succeeding. The capture and control via FUD, Taxation, debanking and ETFs is winning. Bitcoin as a P2P payments protocol is dying. Too few people understand what is at stake. Too many 'bitcoiners' are dazzled and distracted by NGU. If you value the P2P payments MoE freedom Bitcoin provides- USE IT or LOSE IT. Otherwise the current trend of Bitcoin being increasingly used only as a speculative commodity plaything, mostly held by corporate custodians KYCed and taxed, will continue. The freedom of P2P payments may be lost and with it the revolutionary potential and true value of Bitcoin.
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If you are prepared to break the law repeatedly you can use Bitcoin for MoE via LN or on chain, but very few people will and even fewer businesses are accepting.
What choice do we have? I "boosted" this post because of the concerns it addresses... with my own hard-earned sats because like you said it's use it or lose it.
Some of the lacking on-chain activity can be explained by education... it's very shallow amongst the general public.
But NOT all of it in fact it doesn't make any sense.
In my opinion we should have way, way more on-chain activity than we currently do plus places to spend Bitcoin what merchant wouldn't want to accept money that literally goes up?
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Most merchants are not interested because of the perception that Bitcoin is a fringe currency and in many places because of the risk of debanking and general FUD around Bitcoin, plus the fact that so few people want to use Bitcoin so the potential for sales using Bitcoin is tiny. Merchants simply do not have sufficient incentive to accept Bitcoin. If a merchant asks his accountant 'whats involved with accepting Bitcoin' most accountants will advise its not worth the trouble of setting up the required systems. I believe it is a combination of FUD/misinformation and deliberate obstruction by banks and governments. Also 70% of humanity live under autocracies and few if any of those autocracies allow Bitcoin MoE. Of the 30% of humanity who live under so called liberal democracies the subtle but effective obstruction via tax obligations/implications prevents any real MoE use. Bankers and governments do not want Bitcoin challenging their fiat MoE hegemony and they have succeeded in obstructing it. So few Bitcoiners are even prepared to admit this problem that it seems unlikely to ever be addressed, let alone solved.
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Did not understand the concept how an address spending money is spamming transactions?
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its good idea
0 sats \ 1 reply \ @LAXITIVA 19h
My spam solution is shoplifting from 7/11 drunk at 3am and laughing that I stole spam the rest of the nught
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there ya go
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Using it as money is the best thing you can do with bitcoin.
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Whenever I see a small business that takes Bitcoin (even if it's Blink Wallet or something custodial which it usually is) I go there and buy a coffee.
The difficulty is that there just aren't that many places, especially in North America although Europe is much better.
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So where is everyone?
Using fiat. Most Bitcoiners I know are eagerly lining up to use the next great Bitcoin-Rewards credit/debit card. Fiat doesn't bother them, even though they talk about it bothering them. Actions speak louder than words.
If we don't find a way to break our fiat addiction, and stop using excuses such as "taxes" and "Gresham's Law", then we're doomed.
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lining up to use the next great Bitcoin-Rewards credit/debit card
Does the "rewards card" actually pay out in Bitcoin? I get something like 3% back on my credit card... which ultimately winds up as more Bitcoin I can use/save in.
Like I posted above, I use Bitcoin where I can there just aren't many places in the United States. Western Europe much better, but it's a bit out of the way at the moment.
I believe in 30 years we'll have ~1 billion daily Bitcoin users across the full spectrum of custody... all the way to from full self-custody of UTXOs and channels to custodial wallets to ETFs to derivatives to even banks. "1991 + 30 years = 2021" of the internet that's the model I compare it to.
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Blicks requiring 2 sats/vbyte doesn't mean spam trxs get outbid, it means the spammers will have to increase their bid. Which they will. At what point they will finally be mostly priced out is unknown, but I would bet it's significantly higher than 2 sats/vbyte.
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If you watch the mempool/your mempool closely... 2 sats/vbyte prices out the vast majority of spam. And > 2 sats/vbyte 99% of it.
And not only does it get 'outpriced' but it could take days/weeks for the spam to find its way in at .4 sats/vbyte which means it's even more worthless/useless.
If the spammers are going to 'bid up' blockspace... where are they right now?
Influencers some of them are treating this issue unfairly.
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