Canโ€™t wait to try this out! What does the carbonado integration look like? Iโ€™m guessing that if you have a uda with a reference to some media in carbonado it pulls it for you?
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Actually, honestly, we're only using Carbonado for E2EE contract storage right now. That's a much simpler problem on the serverside, and we didn't have the carbonado-node finished in time. We're technically running bitmaskd, our dev server, on a single cloud server somewhere... Once we have the node finished though, we're in a partnership with Hut8 to host our first nodes. We also have have an absurd number of AWS credits, so even having a backup took some convincing, haha... Hopefully we can turn those into sats soon!
If you're curious about the node, however, this is what we have so far: https://github.com/diba-io/carbonado-node Still WIP, but we're getting closer.
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At long last! Truly amazing.
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Seriously... I think I was dead to the world for a solid eight weeks straight at least. I have nearly a thousand emails I need to catch up on, lol
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Excited. Will smash
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haha ty pls dont smash too hard only light smashies plx thx
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Definitely testing this one! What's a UDA? Another term for NFT?
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Haha, basically, Unique Digital Asset. We use RGB21 for ours, though. Very small on-chain footprint. Contract data and media data kept in Carbonado.
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NFT crap. Not for me.
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It's a fair point, and I felt that way at first, too. The longer I've been in this space, I've come to realize I don't always appreciate why some things can be useful at first. And there's a lot of noise and scams and the signal gets lost in all that. NFTs are especially difficult to appreciate because of all the noise, like Bored Apes.
We figure digital provenance for fine art (phygital art is one thing we do) is good low-hanging fruit, but we'll also be expanding the use case to cover proof of purchase to have a trustless, permissionless record of any kind of trade. The dream is to inexpensively provide atomic receipts for multiple thousands of digital transactions that can compress into a single on-chain attestation that's virtually indistinguishable from any ordinary P2TR spend. This then leads us to a world where Bitcoin is not just able to replace all money, but all forms of value settlement, and it's censorship-resistant, so it can break down barriers to trade. This is essential for diffusing wealth all around the world, which will alleviate poverty on a global scale.
And maybe we can obviate the perception of necessity for governments to keep a public record of private property so state-sponsored threat of force can be used to secure it. If there are disputes and there is violence, it helps to have evidence as to who is in the right and who is in the wrong, regardless of whether governments and their laws are involved.
Anyway, all this is also a good reason to develop Carbonado, which is quite valuable in its own right. We use it to store contract data, and will be using it for media content soon, too. https://carbonado.io
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Is there a popular example of UDA? Is this different to BRC-20?.
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Just the ones on DIBA.io. This should be much cheaper, more scalable, and more powerful, since it can execute all sorts of different contracts. The current LNP/BP specs define: RGB20: Fungible tokens RGB21: Non-fungible tokens RGB22: Decentralized identity RGB23: Ordered events RGB24: Decenralized DNS
The details for all of these are computed and kept off-chain, with only an on-chain cryptographic commitment to this data as it changes, so ownership can be verified and double-spend can be prevented.
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I didn't pick the name, but Bitcoin is for everyone, including speculative degens who want to pay real money for receipts to JPEGs... At least our technologies don't spam the chain with a bunch of JSON; RGB commitments are made to P2TR outputs that are virtually indistinguishable on-chain from ordinary P2TR payments.
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Not a F*cking Thing #NFT The future is Unique Digital Assets on Bitcoin
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Hey,
3 questions please: -How does the Lightning part works (fully custodial, via a LSP like Phoenix, non custodial possible ?) -The platform to trade Digital things require an account, isn't it possible to login by signing something from our BitMask extension ? -Is Carbonado an IPFS like storage system to store the data from NFT or whatever its called on RGB ?
Thanks
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  1. We run our own LNDHubX server in the cloud, though we're working to add Fedimint support to BitMask Core, and RGB support for Fedimint.
  2. Yes. We're working on a NIP for Passwordless Authentication, and plan to transition the marketplace to using Nostr.
  3. Carbonado is structured more similarly to the Nostr relay system, but essentially, yes, the intent is to store RGB21 content there. We're finishing up the Carbonado Node now. Currently Carbonado is only used for E2EE of RGB contracts kept within the wallet, since the actual contract data is kept offchain, the only thing onchain is the cryptographic commitment needed to anchor mutable contract data against a single UTXO.
Does that answer your questions? Do you have any suggestions or value judgements from what you've seen so far?
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Thanks for your answers.
First of all I'm not a big fan of all of this, I left the eth ecosystem a long time ago cause I was not convinced by the utility of what was built in this ecosystem compared to Bitcoin. But I'm still curious when new things are developed using Bitcoin, and RGB could bring features that even if not as important for mankind as Bitcoin, answer to a certain demand from some people.
  • For the Lightning part, I think it is crucial that people can at least have their own keys through a LSP service that you could run or using a partnership Idk. We are constantly shitting on ETH for their wallets and smart contracts execution depending on Consensys but at least they have their own keys....
  • Nice for the passwordless thing and the nostr move.
  • Ok thanks for the Carbonado explanation. I'm a total noob technically speaking but wasn't there a way to leverage directly nostr to store what you have to store off-chain ? It has already a bit of traction so I guess it's much more decentralized and resilient than Carbonado right now.
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  1. That's a good point, and we're also very excited about LDK. When they release PTLCs and async payments, hopefully later this year, we can finally have the technology to go down that road. And maybe Ark can help scale that.
  2. ty, if you want to provide feedback, here's the issue (NIP soon): https://github.com/nostr-protocol/nips/issues/558
  3. And yes, kind of, but that's just for metadata, not the data itself: https://github.com/nostr-protocol/nips/blob/master/94.md
I think there's other NIPs in the process of sorting out storage payments and such, but as far as I know, they're not trustless. Carbonado is probabilistically trustless, and it can do this without a blockchain. It uses stream verification encoding to periodically ask for short pieces of a file, 1KB each, in multiple random places that can't be known in advance. I can then verify that along with a checksum against a 32 byte Blake3 merklehash. If we chunk data into 32MB segments, only 1MB of hashes are needed to secure 1TB of storage. Also, the Nostr devs seem pretty adamant about sticking to SHA-256, which is pretty slow these days without hardware acceleration. And finally, the storage providers are paid in sats for the value they provide, and there's even geocoding metadata added as well for georedundancy: https://github.com/diba-io/carbonado/issues/13
As for your original point, you might appreciate some of what I said in this response: #190465
Maybe it sounds farfetched, but it's good to at least build the technology. Who knows if it will catch on or be successful, but it might be useful to be prepared just in case... Bitcoiners are like the doomsday preppers and gun nuts of economics.
And regardless, in the very least, it's good to satisfy the demand for shenanigans without having to tell people to buy something other than Bitcoin. Ideally it wouldn't be through some wasteful, naive, and risky implementation like BRC-20, either.
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Well, somehow the use cases don't interest me, but I'm happy for you ๐Ÿ™‚
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Totally fair! I'll certainly be custodying the majority of my savings in my Foundation Passport, though we do plan to add hardware wallet signing support, watch-only wallets, full self-hosting of the web wallet on Start9 and Umbrel, and a fully open source UI written in Rust. The point is to increase Bitcoin's utility, and RGB21 is a fantastic way to implement a system of receipts for trustless trade, for example.
Is there anything in particular that kills it for you?
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Mainly I don't care about digital assets/nfts (the fact that you can run multiple versions of "RGB" and similar solutions on the same BTC blockchain means that there's no uniqueness to the art that defined as NFT), I don't care about financial products (some debt based solutions, smart contracts, trading, markets...) and I don't understand Carbonado, so no opinion there :)
I have some interest in p2p trading and buy/selling of real items, but there it also sounds like RGB is one of many solutions.
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What about prediction markets? ;)
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Good to know! And you are correct with RGB, the amount of digital assets that can be anchored to the UTXO is, well, it's not limitless, but it's a lot.
Carbonado is a trustless and permissionless decentralized storage protocol that uses Nostr keys to sign and encrypt stored data.
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Hey, 3 questions please: -How does the Lightning part works (fully custodial, via a LSP like Phoenix, non custodial possible ?) -The platform to trade Digital things require an account, isn't it possible to login by signing something from our BitMask extension ? -Is Carbonado an IPFS like storage system to store the data from NFT or whatever its called on RGB ? Thanks