I would love to track my Bitcoin/Lightning expenses across wallets. Privately, of course!
https://bitcoinpolis.gitlab.io/posts/2022/04/29/private-finance-tracker.html
Are there any projects doing this? Or ideas how to build this?
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This is what I'm building right now with Zaprite. A personal budgeting app as well as a fully-fledged accounting app.
Right now the MVP (web app) uses cloud hosting to track txs, so it's not ideal for privacy.
But the plan is to eventually build out a privacy app that can run on your own node. Connect any number of wallets and track all your finances and get reporting.
Do you have a link? Something I can try?
The MVP is live at https://app.zaprite.com
You just need an email address to sign-up. No KYC.
Very cool. This looks like solution for companies/contractors who want to accept Bitcoin and keep track of their invoices. Right?
Would it work for personal spending? I'm looking for something to track my regular spending (mostly over Lightning) so that I can keep track of how much I spend on groceries, gas, utilities, etc...
Yes, exactly. The current product is geared towards companies/contractors.
But we are also building out a personal budgeting app to track Bitcoin/Lightning spending.
Using it for my small business, works great 👍
Amazing. Would love to get any feedback you have. Always happy to jump on a call anytime if you'd like, or feel free to ping me on Twitter (@john_zaprite).
Actual just became open source so this might be a good option.
https://actualbudget.com/open-source
Would be great to tie this in with lightning
Is there any info on how to import data into Actual? (ie. was there integration with existing banks/credit cards, like Mint has)
Wow. This is fantastic. Yes, connecting this with Bitcoin/Lightning wallets is what we need.
I mean this could be either a weapon for good or for eviiiiiiilllll.. lol jk jk im sure there already is tech that exist especially with you willing providing wallet addresses etc...
I don't wanna provide my addresses to anyone. Also, I think LN is even more important than main chain transactions.
Yeah, I know. It smells like target for IRS:-) that's why privacy and self-custody is important
Perhaps the ledger-cli project could play a role. If wallets could export to this format, you've got a ready-made, opensource system to analyze your own finances locally.
Interesting. I think our fork of SBW might do export to ledger format. Because it already stores some meta in UI provided by LNURLs and onchain payment info.
Do you have link to your fork?
It is kinda special. We explore synthetic assets on LN although wallet supports real channels as in original SBW. Currently only Euro hosted channels (custodial) are supported by the wallet.
https://standardsats.github.io
Also, what is Ledger format?
Not related to hardware wallet.
Just some text format for accounting tool.
Why complicate things when it could be simple?
Take whatever other "finance tracker" app, software, accounting system and replace any shitcoin fiat used in that app with sats.
Done.
In the end what is bitcoin? digital cash. That's all.
What financial software tracker exists that doesn't steal my data? Using something that already exists would be to best, but I don't want anyone to know addresses I own, or how I spent my sats.
why do you need to put any btc address in there?
You are tracking money, expenses, not specific addresses.
Coin control you do at wallet level not outside...
I think what you are saying is that tracking my spending is orthogonal to whether its fiat or Bitcoin, right?
I could just type every spending into separate tracking app manually, but I'm hoping to automate this. Mint is very convenient because of that, but totally sucks for privacy.
But the main question is: why would you want to do that?
Tax purposes? Fuck taxes! Taxes are theft. Who is paying taxes is a slave.
Personal tracking? Just a dumb excel is more than enough for personal use.
I'm not interested in paying taxes!
I currently use this for analyzing my spending. Helps me plan, and also control how I spend my sats. Ie, how much does my family burn a month? What is essentially? -> Can I quit my job and work on Bitcoin, without putting my family in risk?
I agree that spreadsheet can solve that, but in reality I don't wanna do the work of typing in every little expense into spreadsheet... that's why I actually use Mint for fiat tracking, despite the fact that it's absolutely horrible for privacy. The convenience. I don't need to type every expense. Just once a month review how I spend. I think it's possible to make this convenient and private.