Open Source Liability is Coming \ stacker news ~tech

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Open Source Liability is Coming developersalliance.org/open-source-liability-is-coming/

2387 sats \ 18 comments \ @Rsync25 28 Dec 2023 tech

588 sats \ 5 replies \ @niftynei 28 Dec 2023

Im American so I might have a different understanding of the problem here, but my read on this is the liability is really only a problem for companies that accept payment for software services.

The article supports this: “If a commercial software product causes harm, whoever put the software on the market will soon be strictly liable.”

This is a warning for software corporations that use open source code. The business is going to be strictly liable for any code that’s used in their service, even the bits open source devs wrote.

There’s a long history of open source devs struggling to be paid for the usage of their work, maybe this is ironically the legislation that makes it suddenly important to be paying open source devs, mainly as a way to get them to hold liability for their work 🤣

tldr: this is a commercial software problem 🤷

593 sats \ 3 replies \ @petertodd 28 Dec 2023 freebie

Im American so I might have a different understanding of the problem here, but my read on this is the liability is really only a problem for companies that accept payment for software services.

Unfortunately not. The EU is considering making OSS devs liable even if they provide the software free of charge. The Debian project actually just held a vote on a statement of concern, as in the worse case, Debian would have to either shutdown, or maybe prohibit use of Debian by anyone in the EU. And of course, in an extreme enough situation, even that wouldn't remove the liability.

704 sats \ 1 reply \ @niftynei 28 Dec 2023

That’s very different from what the posted link says which covers commercial software. Do you have a link to the source / law draft?

In the US, I think you’d find it very difficult to establish a responsibility for warranty/liability without a financial relationship or exchange.

Most contracts in the US aren’t valid without a monetary component (eg paying a dollar in exchange for rights).

Publishing code making you liable for the usage of that code is a very novel conceptualization of responsibility.

110 sats \ 0 replies \ @petertodd 29 Dec 2023

That’s very different from what the posted link says which covers commercial software. Do you have a link to the source / law draft?

Read the article again. Towards the end it talks about how even unpaid OSS may still be held liable.

While the US often requires consideration to establish liability even in the US in many cases it doesn't, and other legal systems operate differently.

Publishing code making you liable for the usage of that code is a very novel conceptualization of responsibility.

For example, if you have a pool, even with a fence around it, you can still be held liable if a kid manages to get into the pool and drowns. It's not surprising to me that some politicians would try to stretch the meaning of liability to cover OSS too.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @OgFOMK 1 Jan

Jurisdictions built on Fiat currency will become obsolete. In the mean time and it will get mean. A lot of people will not get paid for the work they do. They will become slaves to mediocrity.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @OgFOMK 1 Jan

The result is communism which will product shitty software because any donation will be seen as payment.

162 sats \ 1 reply \ @petertodd 28 Dec 2023

EU politicians should be liable for their bad laws.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @OgFOMK 1 Jan

Unfortunately that is the rub of Government (Kubernetics + Mental control). Actors do not suffer from bad decisions and they benefit regardless of any decisions because government is wealth confiscation and mind control. Sure a "leader" gets voted out but he or she still resides in the system as a lap dog and they continue to extract wealth in the name of the common good. Those willing to do anything are rewarded. The incentive is to perpetual machinations.

71 sats \ 0 replies \ @elvismercury 28 Dec 2023

So, how is open-source software implicated? If a commercial software product causes harm, whoever put the software on the market will soon be strictly liable. You will need to prove that your code wasn’t to blame to escape the costs. But what if you’ve embedded open-source code, used open-source tools, or called open-source APIs? Under the pending rules, you’d be liable for any errors in those sources as well, regardless of whether you directly contributed or not. A license like the one Apache provides won’t help, since state-imposed strict liability isn’t a harm that can be licensed away by private actors. The user must be made whole, and that’s on you.

24 sats \ 2 replies \ @jgbtc 28 Dec 2023

They're killing the goose that laid the golden egg.

31 sats \ 0 replies \ @xz 28 Dec 2023

The E.U is an irrational domain. IMO, untethering the monetary union would be the best thing.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @OgFOMK 1 Jan

They don't get paid that way. They get paid by projecting power. Regardless of the outcome.

34 sats \ 0 replies \ @faithandcredit 28 Dec 2023

the road to hell is paved with good intensions. Europe never got the memo. And the EU will continue to turn the economy upside down until people are literally starving. Thats all. Governments gonna government.

110 sats \ 1 reply \ @franzap 28 Dec 2023 freebie

Even if only in Europe I think this is terrible, and the same for the proposed legislation of effectively banning bitcoin in the US. I hope none of these pass.

However, maybe we should start thinking that the world is a huge place and that not everything is EU and US. Maybe, they will become shitholes worth escaping, and give way for other countries to set the bases for becoming world powers, the ones that embrace freedom and sound money. It would certainly not be the first time in history that this happens.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @OgFOMK 1 Jan

I agree. I unfortunately find that the way we think is not how sociopaths think. The sociopath is behind the scenes and he doesn't need one thing or another. He needs blood. How he gets the blood is by controlling the opposition.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @OgFOMK 1 Jan

https://bits.debian.org/2023/12/debian-statement-cyber-resillience-act.md.html

#370620

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @OgFOMK 1 Jan

Put in the license that your product is only for people who live outside of a nanny state.

chick box: "I'm 100 percent responsible for the use of this product." Like my Honda gets me to click every time I start the car.

click box: "I believe in freedom of speech. By clicking this box I am kinesthetically communicating my desire to use this software to say things with a computer."

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @CruncherDefi 28 Dec 2023 freebie

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