Not trying to make excuses for them, but do they realistically have options? I'm imagining the pressures that can be brought on a company like this, even if not US.
This is one trial court making an assertion in a single jurisdiction. There has been NO appellate review. Other districts may have other opinions. Yet everyone is folding their tents and running for the hills? The hours they have put in building this stuff? Have some fucking backbone.
It makes me wonder if people just didn't understand how much of an upset Bitcoin is to US hegemony. That the value prop is merely improving payment technology.
I haven't wanted to say this but I'm not surprised. This is why I'm so angry. The DoJ and FBI scare the crap out of people. The US has a long arm. For years it has blown me away that more people don't question how the US has the right to even do anything to Julian Assange. He's no US citizen. These authorities are trying to scare all of these project into KYC/AML shit.
The "legal" system in the US is a farce. We live in a police state. It can and will get worse if we bend the knee. The USSR was far worse but in principle we have a system the KGB couldn't even dream of.
The myth that the US is a good actor is so tiring. The US could be worse but it uses the threat of violence to keep the rest of the world in line. Most of the time they just have to use their dollar flex. Those that don't bend the knee are the "evil" nations.
And it doesn't matter who is in "power" in the US. The oppression of the US is bipartisan.
If this is the extent of the actual attack and attention span of the attack performed on the lighting network, pretty pathetic from the most powerful financial cops on earth.
What happens when Github doesn't allow these types of tools anymore?
Also is Phoenix likely to do some kind of vpn checking like Wallet of Satoshi now does?
And realistically speaking - is anyone going to stop using Phoenix? I imagine most people won't stop, unless Phoenix starts checking people's location, and if that's the case, maybe people will start using a vpn with their phone?
If Phoenix starts blocking US users, no way in hell people go out of their way to use a VPN just to access it. Phoenix already has privacy tradeoffs, just wouldn't be worth it at that point. Other options available.
This is true. The general public has been conditioned for years to get apps from app stores though. That's the challenge. If you want freedom it isn't free.
Unless you have enough inbound liquidity on lightning for either of those wallets there isn’t a cheapest way, you will have to do an on chain transaction to open up a channel with enough liquidity.
likely because of the federal actions against the Samourai Wallet team. Being arrested for running an unregistered money service business is having a chilling effect.
edit: From ACINQ who runs Phoenix Wallet
Recent announcements from US authorities cast a doubt on whether self-custodial wallet providers, Lightning service providers, or even Lightning nodes could be considered Money Services Businesses and be regulated as such.
People are clueless. Apple does the government's bidding. They block apps in China for the CCP and provide the CCP with their own "cloud" that grants them access to user data.
Dropping Apple is the way. I realized this several years ago. I like Apple's products but you can't be free and use their OS. Best to learn before you have to learn was my mindset.
As Darth says, people don't listen. I've warned many.
LOL I just bought 10M sats worth of inbound liquidity with phoenix. Cool...
Ouch
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Paid 161k sats due to high fee market
Guess I’ll just keep using it with a VPN through a different country lol
I already use it through an apk and I run a vpn, so that was what I was thinking. Now, I'm thinking fuck phoenix, and fuck ACINQ
Not trying to make excuses for them, but do they realistically have options? I'm imagining the pressures that can be brought on a company like this, even if not US.
I have to believe they derive moat of their revenue from the US. I would think they would have at least waited a while to see how it plays out.
Hate the game, not the player 👀
I wanted to start using my Mutiny wallet more anyway.
Wallet name checks out
This is one trial court making an assertion in a single jurisdiction. There has been NO appellate review. Other districts may have other opinions. Yet everyone is folding their tents and running for the hills? The hours they have put in building this stuff? Have some fucking backbone.
I thought Phoenix was based in France!
Exactly. They won't do business in the U. S. You're cool, for now.
It makes me wonder if people just didn't understand how much of an upset Bitcoin is to US hegemony. That the value prop is merely improving payment technology.
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You have got to be kidding me.
I haven't wanted to say this but I'm not surprised. This is why I'm so angry. The DoJ and FBI scare the crap out of people. The US has a long arm. For years it has blown me away that more people don't question how the US has the right to even do anything to Julian Assange. He's no US citizen. These authorities are trying to scare all of these project into KYC/AML shit.
The "legal" system in the US is a farce. We live in a police state. It can and will get worse if we bend the knee. The USSR was far worse but in principle we have a system the KGB couldn't even dream of.
Exactly right. What really pisses me off is how when push comes to shove, other countries will always do the U. S 's bidding.
The myth that the US is a good actor is so tiring. The US could be worse but it uses the threat of violence to keep the rest of the world in line. Most of the time they just have to use their dollar flex. Those that don't bend the knee are the "evil" nations.
And it doesn't matter who is in "power" in the US. The oppression of the US is bipartisan.
https://m.stacker.news/28339
pussies
This is for the losers that still use google play and apple store...
Download the app from github and nobody gives a shit https://github.com/ACINQ/phoenix/releases
If this is the extent of the actual attack and attention span of the attack performed on the lighting network, pretty pathetic from the most powerful financial cops on earth.
they go for the low hanging fruits... app stores
So it looks like you could get the apk off Github (https://github.com/ACINQ/phoenix/releases)
What happens when Github doesn't allow these types of tools anymore?
Also is Phoenix likely to do some kind of vpn checking like Wallet of Satoshi now does?
And realistically speaking - is anyone going to stop using Phoenix? I imagine most people won't stop, unless Phoenix starts checking people's location, and if that's the case, maybe people will start using a vpn with their phone?
If Phoenix starts blocking US users, no way in hell people go out of their way to use a VPN just to access it. Phoenix already has privacy tradeoffs, just wouldn't be worth it at that point. Other options available.
Ugh. I just started using it and have started to find it mostly understandable, for a newbie. Hate to need to learn something new already.
What are the best other options available?
Zeus and Mutiny are probably the most highly recommendable self-custodial options. Maybe Breeze/Green for a slightly easier experience?
Yeah I know both of them are involved with Greenlight but dont have any personal experience using either myself
Green is fine for on chain. Lightning is still in beta
Mutiny
I follow BTC sessions on twitter
From their wording I'd expect them to geofence their whole backend LSP as well.
Could probably continue with tor enabled though.
when github won't allow things like that, there is codeberg or instances of gitea for example
https://m.stacker.news/28340 Maybe the justice arm of the government is too long.
stop getting your apps in app stores!
next vpns!
This is true. The general public has been conditioned for years to get apps from app stores though. That's the challenge. If you want freedom it isn't free.
Wallet of Satoshi did the same thing months ago. I expect to see more apps follow.
What is the safest & cheapest way to move from Phoenix to Mutiny or Zeus?
You can still just download the apk
this is the way
anyway
No need to be paranoic.
Unless you have enough inbound liquidity on lightning for either of those wallets there isn’t a cheapest way, you will have to do an on chain transaction to open up a channel with enough liquidity.
why ?
FED FUD WORKING
likely because of the federal actions against the Samourai Wallet team. Being arrested for running an unregistered money service business is having a chilling effect.
edit: From ACINQ who runs Phoenix Wallet
view on twitter.comSad Day? or an opportunity to grow? Run your own Bitcoin and Lightning Nodes people.
Centralization gets banned by centralization..
Ugh finally went non custodial and set up a Phoenix wallet. O for 3 now with lightning wallets. Zeus next?
Mutiny Primal
What if I am not an american citizen and I go to USA. Then I go to a store and I use WoS, Phoenix Wallet or any other to pay with Lightning?
I don't understand where this heading or what is the commercial adpotion of BTC in the USA.
Is any retail store in the US accepting payments in Bitcoin or Lightning?
I don't know if this applies to you, but when I'm roaming in the EU (which is free for me), my phone still has a UK IP address.
If you use an eSIM, you may still have a non-US IP address?
Why are they being removed?
so is cold storage banned?
Why is that happening?
Hopefully the github apk continues to be there, but GitHub is owned by Microsoft, an American company, so who knows how much that would last.
Wow...
Everyday a new attack
Dark days ahead for US innovation
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Drop the fucking apple. Apple is controlling all apps you have installed and can disable them anytime without any of your consent
People are clueless. Apple does the government's bidding. They block apps in China for the CCP and provide the CCP with their own "cloud" that grants them access to user data.
Apple is no friend of liberty.
that is the best solution long term!
and fun fact, I only use Phoenix Wallet to see currency exchange rate, super handy. 🙊
Dropping Apple is the way. I realized this several years ago. I like Apple's products but you can't be free and use their OS. Best to learn before you have to learn was my mindset.
As Darth says, people don't listen. I've warned many.
I agree, or maybe dropping the phone is the way, which is what I'm trying:)
The phone is the best surveillance tool every created.
yes, and then the social medias which lead to ppl voluntarily share all the details of their life.
Yeah, social media might actually be better. But they work together.
It could be updated to alternative app storesNah, those haven't come to USA yetAre you only mentioning the Apple products because with Google play, you could always just use the APK?