598 sats \ 25 comments \ @Undisciplined 29 May Stacker_Sports

With the passing of Bill Walton, I've been thinking about the great players who couldn't stay on the court because of injuries.

Walton

My dad, who's not a basketball fan, saw Bill Walton play against Kareem in the 70's. He said that Walton absolutely demolished Kareem. There was no doubt about who was better, at least for that night. I've heard plenty of other people share similar stories from seeing a healthy Walton play. Could he have been the greatest center ever, if his feet had held up?

Kawhi

The other player who I always think about is Kawhi. Before Kawhi's injury, it seemed like he was on track to be in the conversation for greatest small forward ever (obviously putting Lebron in some other category). Kawhi on the Spurs was the best wing defender I've ever seen. It's close with Pippen, but the way Kawhi would just rip the ball away with one hand made it seem like you couldn't allow the ball anywhere near him.

Hill

My favorite player when I was a kid was Grant Hill. The stars aligned for us to see him play in person, once he got traded to Orlando, but of course that's when his botched ankle surgeries completely derailed his career. He was widely regarded as the post-Jordan face of the league and then he missed pretty much the entirety of what would have been his prime, before coming back as a valuable role player on Nash's Suns.

Slight aside, Hill being injured opened the door for McGrady to emerge as a true superstar. The game we went to was before people realized what McGrady was going to be and he put on a show. I haven't been to that many games in person, but McGrady was easily the most spectacular of the stars I've seen live.

Who else?

Who are your biggest "what if" guys?

If I were to round this out to a top 5, I think it would actually be Bird and Magic, despite them both being all-time greats as it is. We missed Magic's late prime entirely because of HIV and Bird threw out his back shoveling gravel. Both guys conceivable could have had four more prime years of performance.

Honorable mention to Pistol Pete, who also deserves to be in this conversation.

view all related items

88 sats \ 3 replies \ @elvismercury 29 May

Greg Oden is a big one for me, maybe the biggest. He's not in the same category as the players you've named, since he never even got a shot; but he sure was an intriguing player.

Brandon Roy.

Not really the same, exactly, but how good was prime Arvydas Sabonis? Those years were in Europe, but the guy seemed like a god.

74 sats \ 2 replies \ @Undisciplined OP 29 May

I wasn't really following basketball during the Brandon Roy years, but it sounds like he was pretty extraordinary and then his career was just completely over.

Sabonis is a good call. His legacy was probably hurt by coming to the NBA at all. He had so much hype to live up to and his body was pretty much shot. A lot of us just think of him as a huge slow guy, because that's all we got to see.

89 sats \ 1 reply \ @elvismercury 29 May

His legacy was probably hurt by coming to the NBA at all. He had so much hype to live up to and his body was pretty much shot.

That's what I remember, too (the giant lumbering ruined body) but it had the opposite effect on me: the guy was still, even as a husk, a substantial player. It made me think, jfc, if he's still somehow this good, how good was he a decade ago?

20 sats \ 0 replies \ @Undisciplined OP 29 May

That's a much more mature attitude than I had. I remember really liking everyone else on that team and he was just sort of there.

269 sats \ 9 replies \ @gnilma 30 May

As a Chinese immigrant kid growing up watching basketball in the 90s and 2000s, and as a kid who played center for my elementary school basketball team, I had always loved watching the center position. When Yao Ming entered the league in 2002, he really caught my attention, because he's Chinese, and also because he's a 7ft6 center, and also because apparently, he can shoot!? Expectations for Yao were high, but he did not disappoint. As a traditional center that dominates the paint but also can shoot mid range shots and free throws, Yao meant trouble for his opponents. His first ever game against Shaq was an instant classic, and Yao only got better as he continued to gain experience in the league and improved chemistry with his teammates.

Yao's first game versus Shaq

However, after 3 strong seasons playing in the NBA, missing only 2 games out of 246 games (LOL load management?) in the 3 seasons, Yao would start to be injury plagued. I believe the worst of it was a broken bone in his left foot, which never really healed and always had lingering problems.

I always wonder, if TMac wasn't injured during the Rockets' playoff run in 2009, and if Yao was not sidelined after game 3, could they have made it to the finals and beat the Magic? I mean, they took Kobe's Lakers to game 7 with Ron F-ing Artest and Aaron F-ing Brooks... If the Rockets had TMac and Yao, they had a solid chance of beating Kobe's and Pau's Lakers, right? They can for sure beat Melo's Nuggets and Dwight's Magic, right? Yao should be able to get a ring during those Jordan-less, Curry-dominant-less, LeBron-dominant-less years, right?

If it wasn't for the injuries, Yao's career would have been longer, and probably filled with several more all star selections, a few more all NBA selections, and maybe even get a ring to go along with it. Even though Yao had an accomplished NBA career and he is already inducted into the basketball hall of fame, I always thought he could have accomplished more if it wasn't for the injuries.

FYI @grayruby, above are my thoughts.

63 sats \ 8 replies \ @grayruby 30 May

Great one. Yao was incredible.

I believe he is head of China Basketball now.

71 sats \ 6 replies \ @Undisciplined OP 30 May

Definitely a great pick. Yao's one of only two players (Hakeem being the other) who I've ever heard Shaq acknowledge being a problem for him to play against.

Looking back, I think I was always biased against centers and have only come to appreciate their games as an adult.

As a short point guard, I admired the more athletic "skilled" players, but didn't recognize how skilled guys like Shaq and Yao actually were.

62 sats \ 5 replies \ @gnilma 30 May

Although they look slow, being a top center definitely required skills. Especially if you are a top center during the era of the centers.

81 sats \ 4 replies \ @Undisciplined OP 30 May

When you're short, it just feels like they have such an unfair advantage. It's easy to overlook the footwork, balance, touch, anticipation, and everything else that goes into playing well in the post.

63 sats \ 2 replies \ @grayruby 30 May

Hey it's not short. It's undersized. My son is already as tall as my wife and he is gunning for me now. He probably has a couple years to go but the flippening is inevitable.

71 sats \ 1 reply \ @gnilma 30 May

How old is your son?

My older son is turning 12 this year, but have yet to hit his growth spurt. I'm 5'11" and really hoping my son will grow taller than me. My daughter, on the other hand, is turning 13 this year and is already taller than my wife. I guess girls hit puberty earlier than boys in general.

21 sats \ 0 replies \ @grayruby 30 May

He is 13. Turning 14 in July.

reply on another page

41 sats \ 0 replies \ @gnilma 30 May

Especially when you're performing all those moves at that size.

20 sats \ 0 replies \ @gnilma 30 May

I think he either stepped down as head of the CBA back in 2023. Still owner of the Shanghai Sharks though.

100 sats \ 1 reply \ @Coinsreporter 29 May

Don't know too much of NBA. Although I have known a lot of players from Cricket who are my 'what ifs'. Now I can recall one from Newzeland—

Shane Bond.

He was the best bowler in early 2000s who could swing the ball at 140+ kph. He had nasty bouncer and also deadly Yorker in his arsenal. At his peak he troubled the best of batsmen including the greatest like Sachin, Kallis, Dravid, Steve Waugh and many more.

However, his carreer couldn't run smooth and in 2004 he injured his knee that went through surgery but only partially successful, though he returned on field but in 2006 he had a back injury that took him almost 2 years to return to Cricket and when he returned he couldn't be 100% normal once again. So, he retired from all forms of Cricket in 2010.

51 sats \ 0 replies \ @Undisciplined OP 29 May

That makes me think of my favorite baseball player, Ken Griffey Jr. He was the best center fielder in the league and was on pace to break Hank Aaron's career homerun record.

Midway through his career, he started dealing with nagging injuries and never got back on track.

42 sats \ 3 replies \ @grayruby 29 May

How about Derrick Rose?

50 sats \ 2 replies \ @Undisciplined OP 29 May

I always think about him, but I don't think he was ever going to be more than a really exciting player. Do you think he was on track to be one of the great guards of all-time?

42 sats \ 1 reply \ @grayruby 29 May

He certainly had a good few years. Whether that would have translated to one of the best guards of all time is debatable but he would have been one of the best players in the league.

50 sats \ 0 replies \ @Undisciplined OP 29 May

That's fair and the injury was absolutely tragic.

I was deeply moved by that 50 point game he had off the bench in Minnesota. It was so cool seeing him get one more great game in.

42 sats \ 3 replies \ @grayruby 30 May

@gnilma did you see this post?

Curious what your thoughts are.

71 sats \ 2 replies \ @gnilma 30 May

Thanks for pointing this out. I did see this post, but I had other things to do before I can find the time to write down my thoughts. I do have a player in mind that had his career cut short or left unsatisfied due to injury. I'll get a reply out later tonight.

42 sats \ 1 reply \ @grayruby 30 May

Awesome. I was surprised you didn’t reply. Thought maybe you had missed it.

71 sats \ 0 replies \ @gnilma 30 May freebie

I saw that earlier today. I was just busy at work, then busy at home, so I didn't have time to write what I want to talk about until now. The reply is up and I tagged your username so you won't miss it.

I've gotten so used to watching/following at least 1 playoff game each day, it feels weird to not have a game to follow. But I guess it gives me time to deal with other stuff at home. Still looking forward to tomorrow's game very much.

32 sats \ 0 replies \ @BitcoinAbhi 30 May

People in India are crazy about cricket, so I can only tell you about the cricketers. If anyone is interested, I can tell you about some players who lost their careers due to injuries.