Hey All - I went to lunch with a coworker today and asked him what his biggest concern with Bitcoin was. He mentioned that the NSA created Bitcoin - and he said this with unbelievable conviction. He is one of those IT guys who goes down all the NSA, cybersecurity, surveillance, and CBDC rabbit holes.
I told him that the NSA is involved in developing encryption tech like SHA, but just because Bitcoin uses this in their POW consensus doesn't mean with certainty that the NSA invented Bitcoin. Further, I indicated the NSA was involved in assisting law enforcement to take down the Silk Road, but this had nothing to do with Bitcoin the primary currency used in the Silk Road.
This coworker's final point was that the world government is trying to get us on digital money, and a stepping stone for that is to get people to do that through their own will (Bitcoin/Crypto). Then, the NSA has access to the backdoor(since of Bitcoin and will facilitate the transition of everyone into the CBDC digital prison.
I don't agree with the final point he made. I don't think our government is competent enough to do this at scale, they can't even create an important website that won't crash. Since the code is open source, we can verify if there is a backdoor - and lastly, we don't need Bitcoin as the stepping stone for a CBDC. A CBDC is something many citizens will voluntarily take as long as they get a free stimmy out of it and are sold on speed, convenience, and ease of use.
If anything, the use of curve secp256k1 seems to hint that it was not the NSA. They would have more likely to have used suite b standard ecdsa over curve secp25r1/nistp256 at the time.
While the idea that Bitcoin came from the State is intriguing, it’s really more likely to have come from the cypherpunk community.
Interesting, I haven't researched the secp256k1. Something to look into...
The government developed SHA256, Tor and Signal, it doesn't matter as long as the code is open and they cannot control it
So the government is actually useful for something, even if that's shooting itself (and other mofos) in the foot.
Satoshi could be someone who worked on SHA256 in the past through the government right? Not likely, but we can't prove for certain otherwise.
Signal 🫠
Exactly what I was going to say 👍
Sounds thoroughly black pilled. If he truly believes that then he must have very little hope for the future. Sad.
Yea that is the vibe that I go from him, that he was black pilled.
Decentralized privacy respecting cryptocurrencies can help ;) Transparency for governments, privacy for citizens. It's that simple. And later we can talk about alternative systems in which governments are not necessary.
You both have great points. I agree with you about Bitcoin being open source and not pre-mined diminishes the importance of who created it.
Thanks! Yea, although I can't read code on a deep level, I know there are individuals who can. I read what I can, and have others interpret the difficult sections for me.
If you are interested I am writing a substack in which I explain the Bitcoin Code 😇
Sure, what's your substack name, is it Tuma? I'll give it a follow!
It’s Inside Bitcoin Code! You can find the link on my profile :)
A simple message for all those losers...
https://m.stacker.news/37266
Fro nocoiners... read more here:
I'll go through the myths debunked! Appreciate the links.
I agree with you. His logic is a bit of a jump.
I’ve met many people like that too. They believe everything is a scam and therefore miss the good things in the world. Black pilled, I agree with @jgbtc.
Also when I read the early correspondence between Satoshi and the others it feels legit.
That would be such a hard way to live - believing that everything is a scam...
Outside of Bitcoin, many other investments people claimed were scams - ended up doing very well (Tesla early years, and alot of .com stocks)
Even if, then so what?
Bitcoin is open source and doesn't try to hide what it does. It's one of the most scrutinised pieces of software in the world. There can't be backdoors in the code itself.
And the cryptographic primitives used are solid secure too, as far as the crypto academia is concerned.
There are a lot of flat earthers out there. It’s ok to stop trusting governments, but it’s also important to find the right mind balance.
So imho nobody’s gonna change their minds by telling them that’s open source, even if that makes totally sense.
Mining? Chinese!!11
If someone is too dumb to understand that there's a life raft right in front of them, or indeed is fighting against being saved, it's okay to leave them.
What's funny was his life raft actually was gold. I felt bad for that response :D
Then why didn't they make Bitcoin scalable in the first place?
Agreed here, they would have created it more transparent and less pseudonymous. They probably would have made it difficult to build in layers.
Interesting point.
Maybe the NSA has all of satoshi nakamotos coins?
lol
I think this was his concern as well, but he was very anti-surveillance state! Very privacy focused. Maybe I can get him onto ecash, coinjoins or something.
Yeah, I dont thinnk those coins are moving.
Maybe. And maybe it is just a way to send some of the filthy fiat into a hole where it is just evaporates when the BTC price drops to the floor. I’ll probably keep stacking regardless.
bet your coworker seldomly uses cash... Sound like he uses apple wallet or whatever is called lol
Its so funny you say that - cause thats how he paid for lunch hahaha
Satoshi Nakamoto is not the NSA.
Otherwise why would he stop posting everywhere as soon as Gavin announced he was going to meet with the CIA?
That's a great point. Both these government organizations would just talk to each other directly.
They are probably misinformed.
Gavin Andresen was invited to give a talk to the CIA about Bitcoin in 2011 as they were starting to get interested in this new thing. This was more than 2 years after genesis. Here's the official thread about it.
Of course if they are interested, just reading the first few messages from Satoshi Nakamoto, archived here for convenience, are a great starting point to try to understand how and why Bitcoin exists.
There are many other sources that clearly don't point towards the CIA/NSA/etc as the creator of Bitcoin. It's just a matter of reading the original posts/emails/source code.
Thanks - yea I agree! I'll check out those threads, they will come in handy...
So, NSA made Bitcoin. So what?
The whole point is that the code is online, is open-source and no back-door can be inserted without everyone noticing it.
Moreover, anyone is free not to update the node in case something does not sound right. What can NSA do? I honestly do not understand the concern!
In time they all come around to the facts!
Everyone does - It definitely took me a few years! Some quicker than others.
If it were the NSA, then the banks, governments and corporations, would promote Bitcoin adoption. There would be a great push towards P2P non-kyc and self custodial hodling.
They do. ETF's, Coinbase, Binance etc. They fight against no-KYC, coinjoin, privacy coins. That means Bitcoin is kind of accepted. And because of its transparency, control/surveillance is also very easy. Think about it.
It doesnt matter who creats it as long as it valuable. And bitcoin babe is vmost valueable