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What information is publicly exposed? The two ends of the channel but not the amounts sent back and forth?
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Is it only worth using Lightning if I run my own node?
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Does a Lightning wallet have one specific address? or is each channel generating a unique address to give to someone? Basically like BIP-47 / PayNim?
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if someone knows that i opened a channel with Bob, do they also know that i opened a channel with Jill? Or are these two channels totally different from an observer perspective?
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2 sats \ 11 replies \ @k00b 30 Dec 2021
Off the top of my dome. Someone please correct me if I'm mis-remebering.
Either way, I'd read this staple (https://abytesjourney.com/lightning-privacy/) by @cycryptr.
- channels and their capacity but not their balance
- you will have more control of your privacy if you run your own node
- lightning nodes have a single pub key to identify themselves currently
- not necessarily if they only know you opened a channel with Bob. They would know someone who opened a channel with Bob also opened a channel with Jill and might deduce that it's you.
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0 sats \ 3 replies \ @DarthCoin 31 Dec 2021
For #3 we can add: LNURL-w, LNURL-p, LNURL-auth, Lightning Address, keysend
Keysend is one of the best way to use LN in full privacy. Right now these apps support it: Blixt, Breez, Thunderhub.
Here is explained https://youtu.be/W3rb_26QswM
For #4, we have to remind to OP that through a channel you can move infinite amount of sats meanwhile the "visible" balance of that channel will always be the same. So absolutely NOBODY will know how many sats where pass through that channel during x time. What more privacy you want from that?
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0 sats \ 2 replies \ @NA 1 Jan 2022
Keysend doesn't add any privacy whatsoever, it relies on knowing the pubkey on the node just the same as in an invoice.
With channel probing, a very common practice, others can know the true balance of a channel. Sure, there could have been many payments back and forth in the ~19s (less if already have an idea of the prev balance) it takes to re-probe a channel on average, but practically speaking that's not the reality that it changes that much for an every day user that quickly.
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0 sats \ 1 reply \ @DarthCoin 2 Jan 2022
This is quite blatant not true. Probing will show nothing in terms of privacy.
As I explained in this guide you can use private channels/ private nodes / keysend in a simple mode that cannot be traced in any way. Use your imagination, there are many ways to do it.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @NA 3 Jan 2022
I'm sorry but you're wrong, especially in your generous use of extreme statements such as "show nothing", "any way", and "full privacy". Not only is probing a privacy concern for public channels but it's a concern for these "unannounced" channels you think are private as well. It's in my linked guide above, give that a read and let me know if you have any questions.
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0 sats \ 6 replies \ @thrown OP 30 Dec 2021
number 3 is pretty disappointing in particular. seems like the system could be designed without static addresses even existing “on the network” so to speak. privacy chains like Beam are like that.
as is, bip-47 / PayNim seems way more private than all this and it’s a shockingly simple solution.
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0 sats \ 5 replies \ @DarthCoin 31 Dec 2021
In regards of privacy, LN is much better than using onchain. Period.
https://darthcoin.substack.com/p/lightning-cleaning-machine
and
https://darthcoin.substack.com/p/node-liquidity-guide
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5 sats \ 4 replies \ @thrown OP 31 Dec 2021
Easier to "clean" your money through one single coinjoin though, isn't it?
At least it's easier than learning this whole Lightning system.
Or exchange it for Monero and exchange it back.
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0 sats \ 3 replies \ @DarthCoin 2 Jan 2022
No. If you want to be stuck in time with onchain coinjoin, so be it. it's your decision.
LN is the future, if you do not want to learn it now, you will pay a higher price later.
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5 sats \ 2 replies \ @thrown OP 2 Jan 2022
Realistically, the alternative is simply using Monero or not using your BTC for anything and just holding. Both of these options are easier than using LN today.
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0 sats \ 1 reply \ @DarthCoin 2 Jan 2022
LOL you have the syndrome of monero mass formation psychosis
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5 sats \ 0 replies \ @thrown OP 3 Jan 2022
I have the syndrome of desiring a good user experience and not lying to myself about a bad one.
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