Here in New Zealand at age 65 all citizens are entitled to receive a state (taxpayer) funded pension of about NZD$500/week.
There is no means testing.
All you need to do is be a NZ citizen and apply, and it will be paid.
A close relative has decided not to apply now he is eligible and this has gotten a reaction from other family members who think he 'should' apply.
His position is that he has enough savings to probably last him the rest of his life.
He lives a very minimalist budget conscious lifestyle.
He was laid off his work at a government department almost 20 years ago and has already lived off savings ever since, never applying for welfare of any kind.
I admire his stance but am not sure I will have the same strength of conviction when I get to 65.
What do stackers think?
@DarthCoin ?
Is a universal taxpayer funded welfare payment something that you would apply for if eligible?
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7 sats \ 4 replies \ @Juhwang 21h
I'm not sure if this is a moral dilemma at all. Given how much the government steals from me, I would apply. But if I am comfortable enough to live without it, I would donate the funds where I believe needs it more.
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7 sats \ 3 replies \ @Solomonsatoshi OP 21h
I think the moral dilemma is based on the fact that if you accept the money it will inherently place a greater burden upon others to pay tax or alternatively cause debasement of everyones money which is much the same result.
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7 sats \ 2 replies \ @Juhwang 21h
I would say the moral condemnation should be on the government for collecting taxes, not someone who takes whatever's given to them. In any case, I would say it's nowhere enough compensation for what's been taken from us. Accepting welfare ≠ raising tax burdens.
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7 sats \ 1 reply \ @Solomonsatoshi OP 20h
I don't see how accepting taxpayer funded welfare can not cause increased tax burden, unless it is funded via debasement, which is just a sly form of tax anyway.
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7 sats \ 0 replies \ @Juhwang 20h
I see it this way. An individual's utilization of an already budgeted, existing program does not increase tax burden. Government's current fiscal policies on welfare programs do increase tax burden. It should be on the government to reduce the welfare and reduce wasteful spending, not on the individual to reject what's been already offered. By the way, I grew up in NZ too, kia ora!
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7 sats \ 3 replies \ @daolin 21h
Let's remember that we can't actually say no to these kinds of programs, even on the receiving end. If they want you to have "free" healthcare, education, a stimmy check or whatever, you can't just send it back. They make it a hassle to say no.
Drain whatever you can get out of the public sector, which is what they're demanding you to do, then use it for the benefit of the private sector, yourself included, until the programs spiral out of existence.
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0 sats \ 2 replies \ @Solomonsatoshi OP 21h
In the case of the pension here in New Zealand there is no compulsion to apply.
If you do not apply you do not receive it and there is no penalty or consequence for not applying for it.
If however you do apply you are inherently taking funds from all other citizens either via increased taxation or debasement.
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0 sats \ 1 reply \ @daolin 17h
Sure there is. At the very least you get put on the list of people who are eligible but didn't apply. The state always has the option of coming up with a consequence later.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Solomonsatoshi OP 8h
Yes I guess they can in theory do anything in the future if they choose to but currently there are no sanctions or consequences if you do not apply for this welfare...except for not receiving it!
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7 sats \ 0 replies \ @SimpleStacker 21h
It's up to him. Personally I wouldn't consider it a moral dilemma, I'd take the money. But at the same time, if he thinks he doesn't need it, more power to him.
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7 sats \ 0 replies \ @adlai 21h
replace "apply" with "vote" and shuffle the deck of infamous personalities; are the royalties any flusher?
joking aside, I tried giving charity to a cat earlier this weekend and only scared it. Some things are handled tolerably by governments.
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