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Phoenix 2.7.0 - Taproot channels!github.com/ACINQ/phoenix/releases
694 sats \ 24 comments \ @Scoresby 4h lightning
Lightning channels created by Phoenix now use taproot, meaning that they are cheaper (by about 15%), and more private, since they cannot be distinguished from regular transactions. Beforehand, it was easy for third parties to detect if a Bitcoin transaction was related to a Lightning channel operation.
Existing channels are automatically transformed to taproot channels when they perform an on-chain operation. For example, if they receive a Lightning payment that needs to expand the channel (splice-in) ; or if they send funds on-chain (splice-out).
Newly created channels are always taproot channels.
Phoenix is also introducing multiwallet in this version.
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102 sats \ 5 replies \ @BitcoinErrorLog 3h
Are these channels compatible with the old ones? Or does this basically start another Lightning Network?
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102 sats \ 3 replies \ @k00b 2h
I don't think so. All Phoenix channels are private channels with ACINQ afaik. So this is like LND's taproot channels which are private only.
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0 sats \ 2 replies \ @Scoresby OP 2h
But presumably ACINQ runs a node that has both these taproot channels and normal channels? So someone paying a phoenix user can have the payment flow over both normal channels (on the way to the Phoenix LSP and then over a taproot channel to the user.
So a taproot channel wouldn't be a separate network any more than any other channel on its own is?
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102 sats \ 1 reply \ @k00b 1h
presumably ACINQ runs a node that has both these taproot channels and normal channels?
Yes, private channels are a consensus of two. The spec for public channels (ie channels wanting to be included in the network graph) does not support taproot channels yet afaik.
So a taproot channel wouldn't be a separate network any more than any other channel on its own is?
A private taproot channel wouldn't be a separate network any more than any other private channel on its own is. A private channel is like a network of size two, so it is a separate network in a sense.
Public channels which are included in the network graph and can carry payments for other nodes (be routed across) are expected to have non-taproot channels currently.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Scoresby OP 1h
this is super helpful! thanks.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Scoresby OP 3h
I don't see why a node couldn't have both taproot and normal channels, but probably the lightning people should weigh in.
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102 sats \ 1 reply \ @DarthCoin 4h
Great news!
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Scoresby OP 4h
Yes! I'm very pleased with this.
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0 sats \ 1 reply \ @anon 4h
Is it possible for ACINQ to view Phoenix Wallet receipts / payments and correlate them with an IP address, given that they are the LSP?
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102 sats \ 0 replies \ @ek 4h
How private are my payments on Phoenix?
The current version of Phoenix offers no advantage regarding privacy over existing, hosted, custodial wallets. We (ACINQ) know the final destination and amount of payments.
Later versions will be much more privacy friendly, but that's in the works. More details here and here.
https://phoenix.acinq.co/faq#how-private-are-my-payments-on-phoenix
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @redban 1h
I've tried this wallet the other day. Their fees are ridiculous though
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @BeeRye 2h
excellent, Phoenix continues to push the rock amidst the cacophony of noise
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0 sats \ 11 replies \ @88b0c423eb 4h
When taproot channels on LND?
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0 sats \ 10 replies \ @DarthCoin 4h
LOL LND had taproot channels for ages... from v0.17
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0 sats \ 9 replies \ @88b0c423eb 4h
but only private channels
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0 sats \ 8 replies \ @DarthCoin 4h
Exactly. You do not achieve any privacy if you are already a public node. Public nodes are for PUBLIC routing, private nodes are for PRIVATE payments. LOL use your brain. Is like going naked in a public square and scream to everybody that you want privacy and they should not look at your balls... Public is public and private is private. Or you do not understand the differences? When people will learn the differences between LN private and public channels?
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0 sats \ 7 replies \ @88b0c423eb 4h
As long as I understand having public channels with taproot will make impossible to see if a tx was a normal oc tx or an tx to open a LN channel with is a privacy enhancement. If one has a public channel but whoever observers the timechain can't link the onchain tx to open such channel is a good thing.
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0 sats \ 6 replies \ @DarthCoin 3h
It doesn't make sense. If you are a public node, anybody can see all your channels ID, channel point etc. As I said: public nodes are for PUBLIC routing. If you want privacy run a private node.
Or use a public node as a decoy... but that imply to use too much your brains.
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0 sats \ 5 replies \ @88b0c423eb 3h
It makes all the sense if you have a public node but nobody can link those sats moving there with the sats onchain used to open or close the channels.
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0 sats \ 4 replies \ @DarthCoin 3h
OMG you are lost in your own stupidity. You cannot make the difference between the words public and private?
How many times I have to explain it to you? You cannot have full privacy by default when you are in a public realm. Why is so hard to run a damn private node?
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