120 sats \ 3 replies \ @shibe 1 May 2023 \ on: Opinions on Phoenix Wallet? bitcoin
I've used Phoenix but currently use Blixt as my main wallet.
Phoenix Pros:
  • Really really fast, both in making payments and in the UI. Blixt takes a bit longer to load, and payments feel slower, so does scanning QR codes. I'm not sure what makes Phoenix faster. Maybe Eclair is more performant than LND, or I have lower latency to ACINQ (and ACINQ is better connected than Blixt node so fewer hops), also not sure why the UI feels much faster
  • ACINQ is a pretty generous node, their fees for opening channels seem to be pretty low, and they also appear to keep channels open indefinitely (while also giving you a bunch of inbound liquidity). Auto-open channel is pretty convenient too, Blixt has this as well but I've never tried it
Cons:
  • Can't open channels with anybody other than ACINQ. I think this is bad for decentralization, ACINQ is already a massive node on the network. Also their fees AFAICT are not as good as some other nodes, for me fees seem to be lower with Blixt and LNBIG nodes than ACINQ, but I'd have to do the math to confirm this.
  • Another worrying thing for me that put me off Phoenix is that you can't back up your channels on your own. Instead Phoenix gives you a seed phrase that you can use to restore the channel, but the backup itself is on ACINQ servers. While I don't see any reason for ACINQ to try to rug you incase you lose your data, it's better to not trust somebody else wherever possible
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20 sats \ 2 replies \ @BitcoinMaximan 2 May 2023
I think the reason you can't open other channels is because Phoenix connects to a trampoline node, which not many implementations support and even fewer actually run.
As for the backup seed, I've always thought that in case of a channel force close you can reedem your bitcoin with it on chain, no?
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0 sats \ 1 reply \ @shibe 2 May 2023
Hmm, trampolines might explain some of the speed difference as well, instead of my phone with a relatively bad connection having to figure out the route. But there are other trampoline nodes as well
As for the backup seed, I've always thought that in case of a channel force close you can reedem your bitcoin with it on chain, no?
Yes and no. The seed allows you to derive your bitcoin addresses, but you'd still be reliant on ACINQ in the case of data loss to be honest and give you your latest channel balance.
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10 sats \ 0 replies \ @siggy47 OP 2 May 2023
You're right. Phoenix is pretty open about the trust issues in the FAQ:
Phoenix is trust-minimized, but not trustless. Wise people know that there is no such thing as trustless and that it's all a matter of trade-offs.
The following operations require trust:
channel opening (until the funding tx is confirmed) swaps (you pay upfront, and then our node does the swap) You can configure Phoenix to use your own Electrum server to watch the Blockchain and monitor your channels. This significantly reduces your dependency on third parties to secure your wallet.
For a more detailed overview of the trade-offs, see our blog post.
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