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Looking for book recommendations about private associations
4861 sats \ 10 comments \ @pillar 12 Nov 2023 bitcoin
Many of us here despise the modern, Leviatan-grade State and it's absolute power. And we crave for a smaller state that holds less control and regulation in our lives.
Nevertheless, I think for anyone beyond age 5 it comes as obvious that community life needs some degree of rules and organization. And if that is not going to come from the state, it will have to come from somewhere. Property rights, conflict arbitration, etc.
I'm currently looking for reads on any kind of private organizations, be it current or historical, where people joined voluntarily and shared some part of their lives and activities together. I'm specially interested in localized associations that simply sought to join improve its members lives without much proselytism or massive growth ambitions. Just people getting together, voluntarily accepting a set of rules or values and joining forces with the aim of living in a more prosperous way that they would do individually. Some examples that are more or less in line of what I'm thinking of (I know not every group I'm listing here fits perfectly with what I'm describing) would be:
  • Jewish Kibuttzs
  • Medieval European Guilds for merchants and craftsmen
  • Freemasons
  • Different branches of the Italian Mafia
I'm interested in all of this because I'm wondering how Bitcoiners could come together to form their own communities. I want to learn from the successes and mistakes from the past. Meetups are nice, but I'm thinking we will need to take thinks one step further sooner than later.
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545 sats \ 1 reply \ @Lumor 12 Nov 2023
Chinese flavour: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tong_(organization)
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @pillar OP 12 Nov 2023
Cool, this is the kind of stuff I had in mind. Thanks for sharing!
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611 sats \ 0 replies \ @Lux 12 Nov 2023 freebie
From onestupidfuck.com
Trusts, Commerce and Private Membership Associations
Trust Management Organizations (TMOs) and Self-Funding Government
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503 sats \ 2 replies \ @elvismercury 12 Nov 2023
I think you're on the right track. The nature of human cooperation, and the structures that scaffold it, are exactly what is at issue here. How money intersects that is fascinating.
One thing that has stood out for me is that in most cases, people explore this topic in the context of a private org that operates alongside another, more powerful org; often in a grey space or even in opposition to it. Organized crime is a really good example -- those structures have to be viable in opposition to the state, but are also parasitic on it, drawing from all its products, accessing its markets, etc. I suppose there's no way not to be, given the interconnectedness of everything. Other groups are less opposed, like religious and quasi-religious communities. The Amish might be an interesting group to look into.
A more radical thing that may interest you are the Game B people (this might be a decent intro), who are thinking through a bunch of related issues about how to structure a new society without the pathologies of the old one. Depending on your tastes, this may include unsavory elements, since many bitcoiners imagine a hyperbitcoinized Utopia where all the things they like about society are still available to them, and additionally they are rich and there is no one to tell them they can't do whatever they want. In opposition to this fantasy world, Game B thinkers are really wrestling with issues of governance, so season to taste.
A thing that I'd like to press into, for reasons that are probably clear, is how these groups have popped up and evolved in the wake of decline and collapse. Related to what you're looking for, but not the same.
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152 sats \ 1 reply \ @pillar OP 12 Nov 2023
I also think that the interplay between a small, private association and the bigger players of the world, like the state, is interesting. Like, if a private association starts a private property registry for real state, how does that work when the state still has its own registry and wants to enforce it? I also think that the ways of working of criminal organizations are an interesting thing to analyze.
I also find the Amish interesting. More so in their desire to really not bother anyone, convince others or generally change whatever is outside of their scope.
I'll read about these Game B people. But I must say that I briefly skimmed through the wiki and I didn't understand shit. Feels like just a few random pieces of text stringed together.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @elvismercury 12 Nov 2023 freebie
Like, if a private association starts a private property registry for real state, how does that work when the state still has its own registry and wants to enforce it?
The state always takes precedent, since from its own perspective, contract-like things made in other organizational structures have no reality to it. This leads to some interesting intersections where a subgroup enters into an agreement that has important meaning within the group, and no meaning to the enclosing entity (the state). Think religious practices of non Judeo-Christian religions; or ceremonial agreements of native people, etc. Even things like sports leagues, which have their own rules: should players have been able to sue Bill Laimbeer for playing dirty, or should his bullshit only be adjudicated by the League? When does a foul become assault?
I briefly skimmed through the wiki and I didn't understand shit.
It's possible that the wiki isn't a great intro if you don't know something about it already -- I learned about it from it being mentioned on various podcasts. Jim Rutt talks about it alot, he was one of the "founders" of the movement; another was Jordan Hall, formerly Jordan Greenhall. Both very interesting and smart guys.
100 sats \ 0 replies \ @td 13 Nov 2023
There is a lot written about the City of London; network of Livery Companies etc. which might provide something interesting.
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100 sats \ 0 replies \ @Signal312 13 Nov 2023
A random thought - centuries ago in some areas homeowners paid for private fire insurance. They would get a little placard to put over their front door, to prove they were paid up. Firefighter would only fight fires at those homes who had paid. I've seen this in old cities. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fire_insurance_mark
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71 sats \ 1 reply \ @DarthCoin 12 Nov 2023 freebie
I think you are looking for PMAs... private membership associations https://thepmamanifesto.com/ is what I start to create for me and for a small community, with bitcoin, apart from studying and applying the natural law and other stuff like that
Here an example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sh1-8XiEp7Q
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3150 sats \ 0 replies \ @monaco 12 Nov 2023
Thanks
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