Discuss this Quote- John Adams \ stacker news ~BooksAndArticles

3157 sats \ 24 comments \ @grayruby 3 Mar BooksAndArticles

I first came across this quote in the HBO miniseries John Admas. (very good show by the way)

When I heard it I was unsure if it was something that John Adams had actually said or if it was cleverly written to be dramatic by Hollywood screenwriters. I did some research and discovered it was written by John Adams in a letter his wife Abigail in April of 1777.

This is a quote I often think of when I observe how willingly people surrender their freedoms for perceived "security".

“Posterity! you will never know how much it cost the present generation to preserve your freedom! I hope you will make a good use of it. If you do not, I shall repent in Heaven that I ever took half the pains to preserve it.” -John Adams

What do you think of this quote? Have free societies of the west squandered their freedoms? How does it relate to bitcoin? Will early bitcoiners look back at the mass adoption era and think the masses squandered their freedoms by holding paper bitcoin and relying heavily on custodians?

Cheers, GR

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309 sats \ 7 replies \ @gnilma 3 Mar

When it comes to freedom, I think often times people tend to forget that in order to have freedom, one must embrace and take on responsibility. The observation of people giving up freedom for perceived security, to me, is actually people unwilling to take on the responsibility in order to be free. The past generation probably did fight very hard to gain their freedom and to make sure the next generation have the opportunity to be free. But ultimately, it is only an opportunity for the next generation; and the next generation is solely responsible to grasp and hold onto this opportunity via personal responsibility.

169 sats \ 5 replies \ @Undisciplined 3 Mar

I think it's a combination of what you describe and an inability to realize they're being conned by shameless sociopaths.

71 sats \ 4 replies \ @gnilma 3 Mar

Isn't the inability to realize they're being conned a symptom of not taking responsibility to think for oneself? Outsourcing thinking to media and "experts", while following "expert advice" without applying critical thinking. Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.

91 sats \ 3 replies \ @Undisciplined 3 Mar

Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.

When that's the dynamic, then I agree. However, the con is so massive that I don't think it's reasonable to expect people to be able to see through it.

In Plato's cave, the problem wasn't that people didn't take responsibility, it was that some deranged sociopath had severely restricted the information they had access to.

81 sats \ 2 replies \ @gnilma 3 Mar

Control of information definitely plays a major role in keeping the con successful. However, with advancements in technology and the emergence of the internet, the information is out there for the taking. I think it's getting harder and also getting easier to run the con these days. Easier because it is so easy and cheap to distribute lies and propaganda to the masses through online sources such as social media and "reputable" sources. But harder because if someone suspects they're being duped, it is often not too hard to find information to either confirm or deny their suspicion. You can actually do your own research and use your own logic and intuition based on your findings to formulate a truth that makes sense to you.

51 sats \ 1 reply \ @Undisciplined 3 Mar

We are getting to where the only people still being duped are exactly the ones you were talking about who are abdicating thinking for themselves.

I sympathize with people who just want to trust the experts and then go on with their lives. In a functional society, trusting the experts would be a good enough heuristic for most people. We can't figure everything out ourselves after all, so the battle is really in figuring out who to trust and what to trust them about.

40 sats \ 0 replies \ @gnilma 3 Mar

Agreed.

98 sats \ 0 replies \ @grayruby OP 3 Mar

Fair points.

204 sats \ 1 reply \ @siggy47 3 Mar

Glad to see you're continuing the series! I was just going to remind you. I really enjoyed that HBO show also, but I don't recall this quote. It's more involved and maybe better than that similar quote attributed to Franklin- "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

161 sats \ 0 replies \ @grayruby OP 3 Mar

The quote is right at the end of the series. Great way to cap it off.

148 sats \ 7 replies \ @Undisciplined 3 Mar

I'm such an ingrate. When I hear sentiments like that I always think "I didn't ask you to do that for me. I don't owe you anything."

However, we have clearly squandered our freedoms, which is why we're finally seeing a pushback against the regimes.

51 sats \ 6 replies \ @grayruby OP 3 Mar

But when the regimes tighten the screws will we really see pushback. It’s easy to push back when they aren’t throwing you in prison or freezing your bank account or getting you fired for not complying. We will see what the pushback is like during the next “crisis” or “emergency”.

71 sats \ 5 replies \ @Undisciplined 3 Mar

I think we will this time. Trust/belief in government and other institutions is at historic lows throughout the west and I don't believe they have the power to rule through force. Rule in the west is based on compliance. I don't think they're equipped to deal with resistance effectively.

30 sats \ 4 replies \ @grayruby OP 3 Mar

Hope so. I have more faith in the US resisting than Canada. Happy to be proven wrong.

50 sats \ 3 replies \ @Undisciplined 3 Mar

I heard someone speculating that in the event of a hot war with Russia, the US may just conquer Canada in order to maintain a defensive buffer against Russia. So, silver lining?

27 sats \ 2 replies \ @grayruby OP 4 Mar

Only if you guys sell Quebec to France.

50 sats \ 1 reply \ @Undisciplined 4 Mar

They're not really between us and Russia, so maybe just leave them to their own fate.

27 sats \ 0 replies \ @grayruby OP 4 Mar

Deal

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127 sats \ 3 replies \ @026180d3a3 3 Mar

Mostly yes, they squander their freedoms in favor of, most often, perceived financial security.

In terms of bitcoin, it might be another perceived financial security. It may be that what bitcoin should have been doing is making sure what John Adams did do would still be around instead of trying to have some kind of money despite whether John Adams might repent in heaven or not.

87 sats \ 2 replies \ @grayruby OP 3 Mar

Interesting take. So your argument is we might look back and repent that bitcoin became mostly a monetary instrument rather than a freedom instrument? Is that what you meant?

50 sats \ 1 reply \ @026180d3a3 3 Mar

Partly. We might look back and repent that we didn't uphold the rights we were all ready given and tried to substitute bitcoin for.

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @grayruby OP 3 Mar

Gotcha.

150 sats \ 0 replies \ @Entrep 4 Mar

Some deep stance on security here such that you will see the fight for freedoms from the state has started a long time ago

51 sats \ 0 replies \ @dagny761 3 Mar

Fear and laziness are terrible motivators… In situations of suffering or difficulty, it can seem reasonable or even wise to sacrifice one’s personal freedom (or others’ freedom through legislative action). Strangely, this reminds me of the counsel received by Spider-Man that “with great power comes great responsibility.” I fear that more people in the cultural west are willing to forfeit the great power of freedom in order to avoid the great responsibility that comes with it…