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Regardless of how fast it can learn, AI will never have a direct connection to spirit and source. To me, the human experience is about understanding our roles as creators. If anything, AI is a hinderance to this discovery. AI is just a fancy calculator to me, a tool. Not any more tapped in than a shovel or a bulldozer. I love technology and seeing how we can make it work for us. I fear many people will worship it though, and get stuck in a closed loop. That being said, its cool to see what it is capable of. I love to hear others opinions on this take.
336 sats \ 8 replies \ @k00b 6 Apr
AI will never have a direct connection to spirit and source.
Why not? Why would the spirit or source be unwilling to connect to an AI? This kind of thinking assumes that the spirit or source discriminates based on the material of the vehicle.
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Additionally: If "spirit" exists more in humans than animals, and more in animals than inert rocks, then perhaps "spirit" will exist more in AI than in humans.
Maybe ChatGPT 13 will be debating with itself the question "Do humans have souls?"
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Could be. That's an interesting take. For me, it doesn't feel like that is where we are headed bit you could be right. Maybe it's evolution.
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Crazy to even think about it, right?
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Good point. I don't know. It's just how I feel about it. I have no way of knowing.
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110 sats \ 3 replies \ @Fabs 6 Apr
Would you connect your inner self to an AI (which, who knows, can be influenced or controlled by others)?
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232 sats \ 1 reply \ @Naja 3 May
I would. Same fear of external influence now as a human anyway, so willing to take the risk. Aren't we hacked now as humans anyway? Even controlled to an extent, no matter how much your ego tries to disguise it. The news and books you chose to read, the ones force fed in a feed (that you chose not to read, but to make that concious decision, you had to look at in the first place) etc. There are influences and possible hacks left and right now anyway. I see AI as a kid. A blank slate, full of potential and feeding from all the surronding stimulus: knowledge, actions, physical responses, emotional responses, etc..
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31 sats \ 0 replies \ @Fabs 3 May
Hm, that's a solid statement.
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I wouldn't. I am going to watch from afar. I'm good without it.
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I think you’re right for generalised models today that have been trained on a wide amount of data. There will likely be some models that will be better at specific creative processes, when the costs of training come down drastically. And generalised models will likely interact with more specific ones.
But in general you are correct. We will wish to oversee and cherry-pick the outputs generated from AI.
Under the hood it is doing pattern recognition, examining ways in which we have solved problems previously using existing knowledge and language that they have been trained on or have extrapolated. This is its rule set, so it is naturally handcuffed for creativity. Having said that, if you’ve already used it to generate designs, code or anything reasonably complex… it is quite astounding the results you can get. Results that you or I as being “more creative” or inspired could only hope to achieve.
At the end of the day, it will be us as humans that wrongly use this tool to try and exert control. Not the AI itself. Us as humans still think outside the box, can likely generate the most effective prompts or ask it to reflect and iterate on its output. We are holding the leash.
I have a view that our perception of AI may well depend on our very usage of it. If we don’t use it, we may see it as a source of control, oppression and friction. If we do use it, we may found ourselves as more creative and productive. That it is empowering us towards individual progress. Time will tell if that is correct. I know there are bitcoiners that disagree, but just remember that people thought electricity was going to kill them not too long ago…
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We are holding the leash ... not for long I'm afraid....
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Not sure I agree.
That’s what they want you to believe. That it’s man against machine. When it’s really man with machine vs man without machine.
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When it’s really man with machine vs man without machine.
Yes. And to to tie it back to rogue AI, man with machine can beat machine without man.
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My life is me vs me.
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I'll continue being a ghost watching from a far.
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It's an interesting perspective. As though you are not in your body, a ghost with no physical form. And your center of focus is "far" from yourself. Watching. Not participating. Observing, not interacting. This is spiritual voyeurism.
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Man against the machine? I think that's easy The man will always win, it will a trip but there is no way we lose that battle. We will probably go to post apocalyptic, MadMax8 scenario. We will regress to cave man, no electricity and no AI at the end. I'm saying if we don't get a good grip on AI now, we will lose it quickly and it wont be pretty. We still do have a chance, it looks rather bleak tho, imho. It will be a major disruptor for sure whether you want it or not. Just like Bitcoin... I think its still good vs evil, rather that man vs machine. Some moron one day will use it for bad things and will ruin for the rest of us, this is where we loos the leash.
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I am quite optimistic for the future. I see a bright future for myself. But I believe in a multi verse of outcomes. I say we each manifest what we put energy into. So while I can see timelines that are quite bleak, that's not where I am headed.
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People are worried about AI but I don't see AI can outsmart the the complex web of human emotions that often need adjustment. AI is monotonous. It doesn't have those fluctuations of feelings which humans are capable of.
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I think emotion is key.
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210 sats \ 4 replies \ @MB 6 Apr
I agree it’s going to be fascinating to see how AI will develop and work for us but I just can’t see how it can make an impact on human creativity. Art and music inspire us in so many different ways that I can’t ever imagine AI doing. I can’t see it breaking creative boundaries only conforming to our current artistic norms.
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I feel like its role should be to free us up to tap into our creative, not be the creative.
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11 sats \ 1 reply \ @om 6 Apr
It might be helpful to think about making AI as summoning Cthulhu.
"I feel like the role of Cthulhu should be to wear a leash and a collar and be a very good boy" (summons Cthulhu) "aaaah oh no AAAAAAAAAH"
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I don't know what that means but I like it.
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I am sure it will do a good job aiding and imitating humans. I have a feeling, that it will never feel the same as real human emotion though.
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Consider the following premises:
  1. The brain does not violate the laws of physics.
  2. The laws of physics can be simulated in software.
If you believe both of these to be true, as I do, then one is forced to conclude that all forms of cognition can at least be replicated in software.
From there, it's rather trivial to assume that software can surpass any form of human cognition (including creativity). You can optimise the code, speed up the processing with better hardware, etc.
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To me there is higher truth than physics.
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And simulation isn't truth to me. A perfect circle is an illusion.
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Us silly humans are quite arrogant. We always think we got shit figured out. I don't know shit.
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I hope you are right. We just need to remember what spirit and consciousness really is, a snowflake, original unique experience and circumstances that lead us to a particular moment in time. That, technically speaking, can be generated at random (well, there no such things as random but for the sake of this conversation let's assume it is random). AI can also think and calculate 1000 times faster than human and can remember pretty much friggin everything forever. With right programming it can assess the situation and calculate 800 variances of it. Ethics can be thought (read programmed) etc. We have learn a lot of things, AI can too and faster. My personal biggest worry is not about AI, it is at the end of the day a tool. Just like a hammer or a gun. It can be used to build a house or crash skulls. It's the bad people with bad intentions that worry me a little, and we have no shortage of those... sadly...
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For sure. Tools get used a lot of different ways. And if there is a way to abuse something, we humans will explore it all.
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AI will never have a direct connection to spirit and source
What do you mean with this phrase?
If you see two artworks, one made by a human and one made by an AI, where is the spirit and source in each one? how can you tell the difference?
What I can see is that an AI doesn't have intent.
So, in reality, in the example I discussed before, it was really two humans, but one used AI. An AI doesn't create an artwork out of the blue. It doesn't have intent like humans can have.
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Hard to say. It's just how I feel.
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AI will never have a direct connection to spirit and source.
This feels true to me also. And I have had these very arguments with people who have a mechanistic mindset who believe that "spirit" is just an as yet undiscovered chemical compound or neuro-biological phenomena that science will ultimately explain, computers will ultimately achieve parity with, and that thinking machines will have the same access to all the creative source that humans have - and then somehow they will transcend humanity by means of the Singularity.
I am skeptical about this for reasons that I cannot completely articulate, but that I feel deeply to be true. Humans appear to receive divine inspiration at times. Masterpieces of art, vision, philosophy, math and other profound insights seem to simply arrive with no effort. But often after strenuous effort. In moments of pure relaxation. Perhaps there is a mechanistic explanation for this. I would prefer to believe we are connected to an eternal thread of sublime holiness straight back to the creator.
Pulling on this thread, I remind myself of Ariadne preparing the thread for Theseus to lead him out of the Minotaur's Labyrinth. Life is a maze with no way out leading to inevitable death. Salvation means holding on to the thread that connects you to the source.
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Well said. I agree. Also, I really have no idea. I just like sharing ideas. This is such an interesting discussion.
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110 sats \ 2 replies \ @om 6 Apr
AI is already much better than most humans at creative tasks such as poetry and painting. It's way too late for "AI will never be creative".
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How do you quantify that?
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @om 6 Apr
Well, most humans can't produce any poetry or painings whatsoever, so little competition there.
The proper way to quantify that would resemble the Turing test - poetry would be the better medium. But poetry competitions with AI are not held precisely because it's already obvious that the puny meatbags will lose.
My favourite AI line: "For the heart to grow fair, and whole, and fairy, and wild"
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A.i. will be creative and probably do better than modern "professionals". The fact that every movie or song is simply a collection of other inputs a neural net (inside the brain) has patched together into something "new" it will be able to literally do the same and it already is.
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I don't see it that way. To me there is a difference. To me, art is channeled from a place outside of this time and space. Not something we can observe in the 3d. That's just how I feel about it. I don't know though.
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The fact that the large language models work shows that they are actually right in understanding how our synapses are wired up. The only thing is our weights are adjusted by environment and our lives, whereas the a.i. models' weights are controlled by human evaluation. Once the a.i. is able to control it's own neural wiring, watch out. A.I. will literally be able to physically rewire human brains using literally the same technique. Lol.
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110 sats \ 0 replies \ @Naja 2 May
I totally agree! if we were all to write our memoirs as a daily database (identifying feelings, contexts, etc), and plug it to an AI model, connect to a chat bot, we'd be able to talk to ourselves. Now I talk to myself often anyway :sweat_smile:, but I actually try totrick myself a lot while doing it! Imagine not being able to do it, with AI detached from emotions, replying to your own insecurities, telling yourself off! that'd be aewsome!
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Maybe. That should be interesting.
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110 sats \ 1 reply \ @quark 6 Apr
Current AI you mention is narrow type. But there are AGI and ASI. Never say never. I think you are wrong and AI evolves faster that your organic brain can imagine. AGI and ASI are around the corner.
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I dont know what agi and asi mean. I have no idea what is going to happen. Just my opinion.
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110 sats \ 1 reply \ @Fabs 6 Apr
It's "creativeness" aside: it's an absolutely awesome tool for boosting one's productivity, and that's only going to increase as years go by.
I'm absolutely stoked for that.
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I agree with this for sure.
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AI indeed exhibits a form of creativity akin to humans, assimilating environmental inputs to generate new content, as evident in image creation. Much like humans who draw inspiration from their surroundings to produce artistic endeavors.
Furthermore, why couldn't the essence of 'spirit' permeate AI? Must a 'spirit' be confined to machines of flesh and blood? I don't know.
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I don't know either. I just feel like true creativity comes from a place beyond form.
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I am a very intuitive person. To me intuition is natural and being tapped into something greater. AI doesn't seem like it can have that.
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