I have been thinking about what happens if ISPs decide to censor people at the individual / address level. For example, if I am deemed a criminal by the government and that the ISP must cut internet off from my house and my phone. Not that I foresee this happening to me (I live a pretty boring life), but just as a thought experiment. How can someone become robust against this kind of censorship? Can anyone point me to some resources about this?
122 sats \ 0 replies \ @siggy47 23 Aug 2022
As an amateur radio operator, this intrigues me, but first I must put on my tinfoil hat:
https://news.bitcoin.com/no-internet-no-problem-how-to-send-bitcoin-by-amateur-radio/
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212 sats \ 0 replies \ @nout 24 Aug 2022
aircrack-ng to get access to "backup" WiFi and then Tor... :)
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100 sats \ 1 reply \ @jp 23 Aug 2022
Can someone technical explain the difference between Bisq and Robosats? I have used both but am unfamiliar with the differences in their architecture (e.g "decentralized" vs something that is not decentralized)
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100 sats \ 0 replies \ @P2P_bitcoin 23 Aug 2022
Bisq is a "Second layer protocol". To use Bisqm you run a software program (Bisq client) in order to transact.
RoboSats, on the other hand, is a website. Yes, it is a website that can only be accessed via Tor (for transacting, at least) or I2p, but it is still just a website. If that website goes away, you cannot continue to use RoboSats.
Though both Bisq and RoboSats have escrow methods, .. those escrow methods for each are non-custodial. i.e., meaning the platforms don't exclusively hold your coins. Bisq is on-chain and implements escrow through the use of multisig transactions. RoboSats uses Lightning network and implements escrow through the use of a "hold" invoice.
Bisq is therefore considered an exchange that is more decentralized than is RoboSats as Bisq is a protocol.
But RoboSats does a fine job of eliminating the problems of a centralized web-based exchange. RoboSats uses Tor, so even they don't know your IP address (albeit, they could serve up javascript at any time that does collect that info). RoboSats uses PGP encrypted chat messages, so even they can't know the payment instructions provided by the seller (unless that info is shared with them by one or both participants of the trade, such as for dispute resolution). But again, being a website, they could easily add some javascript code that does collect that chat info, for just specific users even, so that still requires a bit of trust extended to RoboSats. And even the concept of a user ... RoboSats is designed so that you use a new identity (robot) with each trade, which increases the difficulty for an observer to figure out which traders on the platform are the most active (which a government considering a crack down on P2P trading by doing sting operations would want to first learn.)
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100 sats \ 2 replies \ @NetWt1oz 23 Aug 2022
Using Tor or a vpn eliminates your ISP from seeing anything about what you do online. I have an always on VPN connection at home using protonVPN. I also use it on my mobile device.
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100 sats \ 1 reply \ @SimpleStacker OP 23 Aug 2022
Yes, but I am moreso wondering about censorship of the entire person based on known things about them, like their physical address. The example would be if they decide to shut off internet to my house entirely. I am wondering if there are ways to circumvent this. I know it is mostly just a hypothetical, but still I would like to think about this more.
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100 sats \ 0 replies \ @tomlaies 23 Aug 2022
Interesting scenario in theory. But in practice you can always use public wifi in supermarkets, shops or city centres. Or leave the country. Or wifi of friends or family through Tor.
E.g. Chinese journalists are in the exact scenario you are describing.
There is no technological way to circumvent all ISPs shutting down your physical house.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @nerd2ninja 23 Aug 2022
What you are asking for, I believe, is BIP 324
https://bip324.com/
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11 sats \ 1 reply \ @DarthCoin 23 Aug 2022
Your concern is real and is not to ignore. The social credit system is here and govs will not let out this opportunity to enslave more the people.
But I would like you to point you to where to look and think more about this aspect:
- Ask yourself, who is the gov? Why have that "authority" over you, a normal man living his simple life?
- Internet in itself is a powerful surveillance tool for any gov. So they will not let you out of using internet, don't worry, they will do everything they can that you will be "wired" in any shape or form.
- Start building mesh networks, independent of "controlled" ISPs. Is enough just few points in that mesh network to be connected to "regular" internet and is all done.
- Bitcoin will be just fine, don't worry. Tor, I2P, VPN and many other tools will be available to resist the censorship
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10 sats \ 0 replies \ @SimpleStacker OP 23 Aug 2022
Yes, I'm very interested in helping build out an independent mesh network. Looking at Reticulum as I saw it on another post on SN:
#17325
https://github.com/markqvist/Reticulum
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @tomlaies 23 Aug 2022
Tor.
/thread
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