0 sats \ 48 replies \ @DarthCoin 21 Oct \ on: Minneapolis Fed's paper on banning Bitcoin to maintain "permanent deficits" bitcoin
I personally don't give a shit about any papers coming from any gov or politicians.
ARE PURE GARBAGE FOR ME.
Let's see if you gonna rebut when the government of your country of residence comes up with such a paper. It's easier said than done. It's also easier hide than fight.
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Please show me where is the paper where I signed and consent that any gov have any authority over me the living man.
I will give you 1BTC if you can show me that.
government of your country of residence
There is no such thing. Is not my government, is not my residency.
If you want to put yourself in the state cage, so be it, but don't assume that I will do the same.
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buahahaha this paper is the only one existed, none of any gov could provide such thing.
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Keep daydreaming! You can say it but you can't do it. Just ask yourself if you can travel around the world freely.
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Watch me.
And please dump all your sats right now. Are worthless for you.
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You're an ignorant wise man. That's all.
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@remindme in 1 year
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You don't care if they ban Bitcoin private custody?
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Please explain how can you ban something that you can't control?
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Sure- you make it unlawful to hold or trade Bitcoin privately.
The vast majority of hodlers have been KYCed.
An increasing ratio of the market is already held by complicit institutions.
A ban on private custody, probably with payment for sats at current market price would mop up most of this threat to USD fiat debt hegemony.
Most of the western world is militarily and monetarily subservient to the US so would follow Uncle Sams lead.
You dont have to get every last sat but if you get a good most of them the thing is effectively captured and controlled. Ala Order 6102.
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The majority of the world will defintely not follow Uncle Sams lead. Ban on gold only happened in USA. The most they can do is Europe following them, but Europe is more and more irrelevant and it is in the process of being destroyed.
If they ban Bitcoin from USA or Europe we move to another country and let them devaluate their shit-fiat-coin until they are completely irrelevant. Bitcoin would only suffer a 2 year devaluation like it happened with the China ban. After that, it will be unstoppable.
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Are you saying Japan, S.Korea, Australasia, Canada, the EU and Britain are not monetarily and militarily subservient tribute states to the US?
These are the nations where perhaps over 90% of the available Bitcoin is held, 90% of that already KYCed and or held under institutional custody.
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Are you saying that if those countries ban Bitcoin it would not be the start of their destruction?
Already major Bitcoin hodlers moved to more tolerant and less taxed countries to avoid the state. If that happens, the movement to LatAm, Asia, and even Africa will be massive, and would only impoverish USA even more.
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Its complex. As China grows the number of nation states explicitly operating under its monetary hegemony- ie N.Korea, Iran, Russia already are and other non 'liberal western democracies' join them there will be some more neutral territories where Bitcoin may continue to operate. But if a US originating ban occurs the number of territories where a free market in Bitcoin can exist could become increasingly small.
The EU, Britain, Canada, Australiasia and Japan and S.Korea would probably be the last to accept trade payments in CBDC Yuan and would continue to support USD hegemony, and a very likely part of such a contest would be the imposition of increasing restrictions on Bitcoin- especially private custody.
If a US based ban could capture 80% plus of the Bitcoin market cap not much is left for those in the middle ground between China and 'the west'.
IMO the downfall of the west is increasingly the capture of our governments by rentseeking fiat bankers- so Bitcoin could reverse that, but it seems an outside chance at best.
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If you stop being a fucking statist and use for a bit your brain you will realize that just by NOT funding those CORPORATIONS (that are nation states) you will remove all your problems.
Watch and learn
https://video.nostr.build/fb30452e7e6e9d307e9ed656284e5e089581018e2c7518503bc5e969069788ab.mp4
Is so fucking simple: stop being an obedient shitizen.
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Do not agree.
Suspect you would be a quivering shivering whimpering wreck if placed into a situation where the nation state is weak or non-existant and left to fend for yourself.
Human are weaklings on their own- have you watched 'Alone'?
Humans have gained their dominance by being in groups.
We may not sometimes like nation state over reach either and can and should protest it- Bitcoin is a classic and elegant example of this- but do not delude myself that the nation state is not the primary mechanism which determines the global allocation of wealth and resources. Go live in a third world nation if you do not understand.
Can also stand on my record of fighting the nation state in the face of its excesses while all around me stood by and said - 'yes what they are doing is bad, you cannot do that' well I did and I exposed them but I accept there are many with many bold words of protest but few with the action to confront the nation state when push comes to shove.
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You are confused. Being in groups doesn't justify states at all. The state is not a group, it is a gang, whose mission is to enslave you.
It is perfectly possible to live in tribes, towns, even regions and continents, without the rule of a mafia gang. It happened in the past with no problem whatsoever. For example, the native Americans, the Spanish before the Roman empire, the vikings, most of Africa just some hundred years ago, etc, etc.
Abusing and imposing over others is in our DNA because we have an ego, but natural law and the NAP is also in our DNA. It only depends on what side you choose.
And it is possible to go a transition: people remove more and more power from the states until it has none. But it probably requires a massive socialist apocalypse, which will happen.
Again, your statist mind is speaking.
WHO fund the nation states conflicts?
Answer this question and you will have the solution.
A nation state will never go against a single individual.
And the most powerful nation state IS the individual. The sovereign individual.
But if you still want to be a shitizen, inside your nation state (prison), go ahead, I have nothing against that. But do not try to put me inside with you. I do not consent.
The vast majority of hodlers have been KYCed.
So what? If they never go back to fiat, what is the problem?
Please explain how you would take my sats from a private wallet?
From this one for example:
Please take them if you can
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Most people will cave to the threat of prosecution and the fact that if they dont surrender their sats will be illegal to trade and therefore considerably devalued.
They don't need to capture all sats and all hodlers- they dont care if you hodl on as long as they effectively end the open market- again, see Order 6102 for effective historical precedent.
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You are forgetting one thing. While governments are doing all this, they are also making sure fiat money is an increasingly unattractive option to hold, and at an accelerating pace.
So there are two forces at play. One is as you describe where government pressures people to turn over their bitcoin, and you're right, some people will. The other is the force of survival that people have in the face of debasing money.
There are many examples in history where people risk life and limb to smuggle their wealth out of bad situations. You seem to think this survival instinct has disappeared from humanity. It is alive and well and Bitcoin makes it easier than ever compared to what refugees throughout history have done. Don't underestimate the motivation debasing money gives to people.
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Good point.
Hope enough people are prepared to stand up and fight for the right to hold Bitcoin privately. Perhaps there will be.
It's yet to be decided but IMO we have to be prepared and realistic about the probability they will seek to shut Bitcoin down.
Saying it will never happen just means if/when it does you will not be prepared for it - and that suits them just fine!
BE PREPARED!!!
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I agree with you. People will not give up, Bitcoin is so special.
However... an unmovable wall (government debt) is (finally?) coming into contact with an unstoppable force - Bitcoin.
And I'm not exactly sure what that will look like. Beyond the ECB and FED papers of late we're familiar with. Some sort of... unresolved conflict.
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Like most Bitcoiners you ignore the reality that as the USD fiat global hegemony has been declining since the Chinese economy and Chinese model of global resource hegemony has been building, relentlessly. This is understandably uncomfortable for Libertarians as it is runs counter to their belief that free markets will always rule supreme- history tell a very different story.
As the tertiary layer of the global network of infrastructure that China is building China is developing protocols to enable competition with the US legacy institutional and protocols which have emplaced and enforced US hegemony.
One of the most important of these Chinese protocols is its CBDC Yuan...sometimes called DCEP or E-Yuan.
DCEP is designed to greatly increase the efficiency of the Yuan fiat system and to enable very swift and efficient international trade payments outside of and free of the USD SWIFT hegemony.
Compared to Chinas already developed internal and external digital payments capacity Bitcoin is a midget.
It is far more likely that the Chinese CBDC will emerge as the major replacement of the USD.
All nations must trade with China or suffer serious consequences and from mercantile market dominance monetary dominance has almost always followed.
Do not think Bitcoin is the inevitable successor to the USD- it is not.
Bitcoin will probably play a minor role, especially in pockets of activity where Chinas advance is most strongly resisted- ie the 'western liberal democracies' who have been the major beneficiaries, allies and tributaries to the USD, but against the Chinese CBDC Bitcoins importance looks likely to be relatively minor.
Please sell all your sats right now! Are worthless for you now.
What are you waiting for?
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Why would I? Gained custody of my liquid wealth as soon as I found it was possible and remain hopeful enough other people see the value of such a decentralised censorship and debasement resistant monetary system- but never thought it was a sure thing-amazed how far it has come already- its something worth being part of whether it fails or succeeds imo.
Fuck the rentseeking fiat debt parasites that own the government.
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Why would I?
Because you are preaching FUD
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Sell all your sats right now. They will confiscate them from you anyways.
I will be gladly take them all.
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I trade only in BTC, I do not use anymore fiat. Please stop me doing that.
When people will understand that all that a gov is saying is only bla bla bla and they need YOUR FUCKING CONSENT in order to do something?
So don't fucking consent, is that hard?
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Who will you trade with?
Most people are sheeple.
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With my close community and friends.
Did you built that community around you?
Or are you waiting for a sign from your lovely government to give you permission?
Sheeple are only those that are afraid of gov to use their sats and read these bullshit so called laws. They are NPCs... that doesn't count.
As I said so many times:
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No I do not have such a supportive community around me though I have tried to some extent to build one.
Most people I know are sheeple with regard to the monetary system - they believe what they have been told by bankers and government regarding fiat money and the few who have bought Bitcoin have done so primarily for the hope of fiat denominated gain.
My guess would be that over 90% of Bitcoiners are not in it for the revolution and could be easily bought out. Hope I'm wrong.
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