Merchant Adoption in the US \ stacker news ~AskSN

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381 sats \ 30 comments \ @jsonbits 2 Feb AskSN

What do you think is the biggest thing holding back mainstream merchant adoption for bitcoin and lightning payments in the US?

Background: After running a bitcoin meetup for several years now and trying to onboard a variety of merchants it still feels like an uphill battle to convince businesses to accept it. Many are open to the idea and are frustrated by inflation, but fail to take it to the next logical step of adopting sound money. Despite the proliferation of good bitcoin content and our efforts to onboard local small businesses, we have still seen little success in getting merchants on boarded and keeping them.

For those of you who have been actively trying to get businesses on boarded to bitcoin what is the biggest hurdle you face?

Education on **why** bitcoin15.0%

Education on **how** to use bitcoin15.0%

Capital gains **taxes**10.0%

**Payment rails** bitcoin><fiat5.0%

Self custody15.0%

Bitcoin escrow services0.0%

Lack of trust in digital money0.0%

Distracted by shitcoins5.0%

Other - please comment35.0%

20 votes \ poll ended

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29 sats \ 8 replies \ @SimpleStacker 2 Feb

There just no reason to. If 99.9% of your customers aren't using it, why spend the time and effort to support that payment option? Even if you are a believer in bitcoin it would be faster for you to just do business in fiat and then buy bitcoin on an exchange or p2p

123 sats \ 2 replies \ @rebel_nomad 2 Feb

Been there, done that, started small businesses a dozen times...

After 2020 hit? No bloody way in the hottest of hells will I even get close to that again, depending on anything from banks via .gov and paperwork leeches, nor will I ever consider paying a single sats in taxes until I am running a solid business with a healthy cashflow again

Will that ever be possible, for me individually and for many others who walked away? No idea, and if so it might be in a jurisdiction that was never even on my map...

So until then its Bitcoin, Nostr, and all related platforms and tech!

9 sats \ 1 reply \ @jsonbits OP 2 Feb

Yeah 2020 was a really big death knell for tons of small businesses. I was running an airBnB biz at the time and couldn't evict my tenants who failed to pay (but I still had to pay the mortgage). Definitely left a bad taste in my mouth...

19 sats \ 0 replies \ @rebel_nomad 2 Feb

Next time a couple of friends with crowbars should work...

We might very well get into a future where property is a real risk too, especially in Europistan!

I have the option of just disappearing for longer periods myself, the state would have no idea about my location, which is the only way I really enjoy living...

49 sats \ 4 replies \ @jsonbits OP 2 Feb

True, but someone has to make the first step. I guess a better question for businesses might be:

What is your biggest problem that needs solving?

Then connecting the dots on how bitcoin might solve it.

Or perhaps more bitcoiners should be starting businesses themselves and asking for it.

It is a lot of time and effort to onboard and then you run the risk of losing them if the price crashes or the onboarding platform gets shut down in your jurisdiction (as with IbexPay).

19 sats \ 3 replies \ @SimpleStacker 2 Feb

Speaking of problems to be solved, I think bitcoin mostly solves "macro" problems, but one intriguing micro use case is for international payments, especially if the local currency is unstable or has tons of capital controls. Thus the most promising areas to onboard merchants might be in touristy areas, especially with lots of international tourists

10 sats \ 2 replies \ @Bell_curve 2 Feb

exchange rate fees wiring fees foreign transaction fees

AirBnb would be perfect for bitcoin payments

9 sats \ 1 reply \ @jsonbits OP 2 Feb

I like this! There was a crypto AirBnB I used once when travelling to London for a conference. They accepted bitcoin but were also heavily shilling some ErC20 token. Not sure whatever happened with that lol.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Bell_curve 2 Feb

Before he started Coinbase, Brian Armstrong was an engineer at AirBnb

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19 sats \ 0 replies \ @0xIlmari 2 Feb

For a merchant who doesn't have any suppliers who accept Bitcoin, it's just an extra overhead without economic benefit: accounting, taxes, operational. He's better off buying Bitcoin on the side as savings.

So at this stage, you will only convince people who'd do it out of principle. Convince them with "Why Bitcoin?"

Once a merchant is introduced to a supplier who accepts Bitcoin, the landscape changes, but you still need to convince them to run a dual-currency operation, which is a big accounting headache.

However, at this point, the more "savvy" of them might realize the potential of hiding some of their cashflow from the government, which is a very enticing prospect. Convince them with "How Bitcoin?"

20 sats \ 5 replies \ @Aardvark 2 Feb

Personally, I think that this is a two fold problem due to Bitcoin not being a mature asset.

Holders don't want to spend sats because they know how valuable they will be given time, and merchants don't want to accept them given how volatile bitcoin is.

A merchant can't HODL because they need to restock shelves and keep the lights on.

So there's a lack of effort from the bitcoin community to onboard, and a lack of interest from the merchants to accept it.

19 sats \ 0 replies \ @nichro 2 Feb

Hodlers want to spend when price is high, but merchants want to receive when price is low

30 sats \ 1 reply \ @jsonbits OP 2 Feb

Interesting, so it sounds like a mixture of Gresham's Law (Bad money driving out the use of good money) and lack of tolerance for volatility when having to pay bills. I often see that but what about a merchant who might only convert some of their revenue to bitcoin while keeping the rest in disposable fiat to pay the bills? Or as underground black or grey market money that is easier to avoid taxes? Or maybe even a better alternative to paying high credit card processing fees or offsetting inflation... I guess I have tried all of these arguments at some point.

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @Aardvark 2 Feb

Ultimately, I just think we're still early. Bitcoin will mature, liquidity will come, volatility will decrease, and merchants will beg for bitcoin.

21 sats \ 1 reply \ @DarthCoin 2 Feb

Bitcoin is not an asset. Is s;mply money. This is the biggest mistake that muricans are doing.

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @Solomonsatoshi 2 Feb

Bitcoin as a speculative commodity is much more easily captured and controlled by the fiat hegemony operators.

Its not a mistake ~ its a deliberate and very sly strategy of capture and control.

How long until most Bitcoin is held under institutional custody where it cannot be used as a P2Ppayments protocol?

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @Solomonsatoshi 2 Feb

Lack of demand, tax complexity and threat of banks removing their fiat banking access.

The fiat cartel have very successfully obstructed Bitcoin and prevented it threatening their MoE hegemony.

Most Bitcoiners don't see this, blinded by the speculative commodity narrative that has been pushed.

Institutional custody is steadily eroding Bitcoins MoE capacity and liquidity.

Boiled frog anyone?

10 sats \ 3 replies \ @DarthCoin 2 Feb

I always said this, b ut people still ignore it and continue with NgU, BSR, ETFs, tether over LN and all that crap....

10 sats \ 2 replies \ @Solomonsatoshi 2 Feb

Most people want government - because individuals alone are weak and vulnerable while governments can provide security and wealth.

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @DarthCoin 2 Feb

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Solomonsatoshi 2 Feb

Incapable of responding to the points made with credible reasoning and logic Darthcoin tries to crudely shoot the messenger.

Ipso facto - Darthcoins irrational ideology cannot be defended with logic and reason.

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @fishious 2 Feb

Maybe bitcoiners themselves need to become merchants and create businesses that cater to people who pay in bitcoin rather than trying to persuade existing merchants.

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @Bell_curve 2 Feb

other: exchange rate risk/volatility

Merchants can't stomach exchange rate volatility between dollar and btc

10 sats \ 2 replies \ @hynek 2 Feb

I think there needs to be demand from paying bitcoiners first

28 sats \ 1 reply \ @hynek 2 Feb

And bitcoiners need to go full in bitcoin even before that. Otherwise they fall in Gresham's law fallacy

9 sats \ 0 replies \ @jsonbits OP 2 Feb

Why I advocate heavily for #GetOnZero... If you have no fiat, you will need to sell some SATs from time to time to pay bills. You also get the max potential upside when it runs.

0 sats \ 3 replies \ @DarthCoin 2 Feb

Try to explain them that bitcoin is simply money. That's why they are reticent to use bitcoin.

10 sats \ 2 replies \ @Solomonsatoshi 2 Feb

Simply money that embroils any business that uses it in complex tax obligations and potential loss of fiat banking access. Simply money that very few holders of use or understand as simply money but most see and use as a speculative commodity...because that is the narrative that fiat powers have slyly pushed.

16 sats \ 1 reply \ @jsonbits OP 2 Feb

Sadly... I definitely see those forces at work here but am still optimistic we will prevail.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Solomonsatoshi 2 Feb

I hope so too.