Best Places for a Second Passport? \ stacker news ~earth

2216 sats \ 59 comments \ @kr 10 Apr earth

Inspired by @kepford’s recent link post about rich people getting second passports, I thought this would be a fun discussion to have.

A few questions for stackers…

What country is on the top of your “second passport” list?
If you are comfortable sharing, which country are you living in now?
What are your highest priority items when selecting a country for a second passport?
Would your answer change if you needed to live in that country full-time?
What signals are you looking for that might determine whether you need a second passport?

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567 sats \ 6 replies \ @kepford 11 Apr

Remember this post Uruguay - The New Land Of The Free? 🇺🇾 by @davidw

21 sats \ 4 replies \ @kr OP 11 Apr

right, i want to visit at some point

377 sats \ 3 replies \ @davidw 11 Apr

Hit me up if you (or anyone else) wish to grab a beer. Nov-March is the best time.

71 sats \ 1 reply \ @kepford 11 Apr

I would love to visit, no current plans but if we do I will hit you up. Your post was ridiculously good.

76 sats \ 0 replies \ @davidw 11 Apr

Awesome. Thank you and for bringing attention to it again @kepford.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @kr OP 11 Apr

will do!

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Silent_Hodler 13 Apr

Very expensive food.

222 sats \ 2 replies \ @kepford 11 Apr

I think its important to think through the whys first. I don't want to share my details or what I want but having a list of factors or things you are concerned about in your current country is important because if you don't you could end up wasting a lot of time and money.

There are services that offer help to people wanting another passport as well.

216 sats \ 0 replies \ @davidw 11 Apr

I would echo that. Ultimately most people should just take a few trips on scouting missions to see if it ‘feels right’ first. But options should be sought beforehand, not when you’re in a panic or rush.

You will also need to collect a bunch of paperwork and get things apostilled and boring jazz. Those documents can expire in 6 months, so you should probably only go ahead with that if you’re convinced it’s time and a place you know.

I skipped that step for the simple fact that I did a bunch more PoW than the average stacker. Sometimes you just know.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @kr OP 11 Apr

makes sense, gotta know what you want and want to avoid before making big decisions

203 sats \ 21 replies \ @Bell_curve 10 Apr

Switzerland or Japan

Wealthy countries Very little crime High trust society Very little immigration from North Africa

Currently USA I need to learn more languages

105 sats \ 12 replies \ @kr OP 11 Apr

those would be up there on my list too.

New Zealand seems like a good bet for someone who doesn’t want to learn another language.

133 sats \ 0 replies \ @Bell_curve 11 Apr

A friend of mine in Texas has Canada and Croatia citizenship. He was born in Yugoslavia.

Permanent resident in Texas, left California after 20 years

62 sats \ 10 replies \ @Bell_curve 11 Apr

NZ is a good choice.

What about Australia 🇦🇺?

10 sats \ 7 replies \ @kepford 11 Apr

Weren't NZ and Australia pretty authoritarian during Covid? Seems like they were IIRC.

65 sats \ 3 replies \ @02bcd3eeb0 11 Apr

Yeah, they where both fucked during covid. Now everyone just acts as if nothing happened and they weren't fucking Nazis at the time.

10 sats \ 2 replies \ @justanumber 12 Apr

Yeah, they where both fucked during covid. Now everyone just acts as if nothing happened and they weren't fucking Nazis at the time.

Yes indeed!

10 sats \ 1 reply \ @nym 12 Apr

It'll happen again with the next crisis.

6 sats \ 0 replies \ @02bcd3eeb0 15 Apr

Australia is rolling out digital IDs, which will no doubt be linked to vaccination status. CBDCs are around the corner. It will be full Chinese style commie credits for being a good boy or girl and doing what you are told.

reply on another page

55 sats \ 1 reply \ @Bell_curve 11 Apr

Yes especially Australia

But NZ was also wacky with masks, vaccines and lockdowns

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @kepford 11 Apr

This is why for me, I'd make a list of things I'm concerned about or don't like about where I live. There isn't any place on earth that is perfect. Its gonna come down to trade-offs and compromises. There are many factors. The other thing is that you can't just trust the media about what it is like living somewhere. Some places within the same jurisdiction are unaffected by wacky politicians.

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @justanumber 12 Apr

NZ (and OZ) totally fucked up WEF puppet politicians, couldn't do anything without the digitial jab pass, except be in nature and go to the supermarket to buy groceries, people look at you like you were a freak for not wearing the blue face rags. And the cost of living is thru the roof!! housing shortage in NZ is totally fucked, families were living in cars a decade ago, it's crisis point now.

10 sats \ 1 reply \ @kr OP 11 Apr

Australia seems a lot like new zealand with more spiders and snakes, someone correct me if i’m wrong 😅

132 sats \ 0 replies \ @Bell_curve 11 Apr

Kangaroos 🦘 and koalas 🐨

NZ has nicer people.

NZ is also more free market friendly

Also voting is mandatory in Australia. They seem to love mandates

72 sats \ 5 replies \ @kepford 11 Apr

I've heard both are difficult to obtain citizenship.

65 sats \ 3 replies \ @chairman_pretense 11 Apr

Functionally impossible to get either unless you're very wealthy. Switzerland for example is a "decentralized" country - political matters are decided by individual cantons (administrative districts), including citizenship.

Sounds great but it also means your individual neighbours get a say in your citizenship, think having a HOA decide your citizenship. Applicants have failed because they didn't know of a bear enclosure in the local zoo, or because they didn't enjoy skiing: https://www.iamexpat.ch/expat-info/swiss-expat-news/5-times-swiss-citizenship-was-denied-strangest-reasons

Sounds like a nightmare of bureaucracy and petty mindedness.

75 sats \ 2 replies \ @Bell_curve 11 Apr

Getting citizenship should be difficult not easy

It’s a feature not a bug

If it’s too easy the result is social unrest

Think of it like a country club. They don’t let anyone in and you need money.

If you don’t like skiing then Switzerland is the wrong place for you.

If you enjoy praying facing Mecca five times a day, Switzerland is the wrong place for you. In fact western civilization is the wrong place for you.

10 sats \ 1 reply \ @chairman_pretense 11 Apr

Getting your first citizenship is the easiest thing on earth. It's getting a 2nd that becomes a challenge!

It's funny really, it's a bit like how we let any pair of morons become parents. But if a couple want to adopt they go through an incredibly strict process.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Bell_curve 11 Apr

Good analogy

The naturalization process should be difficult. The USA citizenship test is a joke

Regarding moronic parents, we should consider voluntary sterilization of imbeciles

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Bell_curve 11 Apr

Makes sense, a feature not a bug

10 sats \ 1 reply \ @SpaceHodler 11 Apr

I like Switzerland, but it's been sucking the EU's dicks a bit too much for my liking lately. Moreover, expensive and has a wealth tax.

Panama is a good one, still a bit knee-bendy as of late (the banking secrecy has weakened), but a good location (close to many of my friends in Costa Rica), a finance hub, no CGT, solid climate and latitude, understandable language. Colombia I hear is a good one too, and Mexico is up-and-coming. And Costa Rica for me for the community and friends.

Then you have the Caymans, known for resisting external pressures.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Bell_curve 11 Apr

I can’t believe Swiss citizens tolerate a wealth tax!

Wealth taxes like the inheritance tax are inefficient. The cost of enforcement is greater than the tax collected.

180 sats \ 3 replies \ @StillStackinAfterAllTheseYears 11 Apr

Nice try, fed.

But seriously, my priorities would be the Nordic countries (Iceland first, but any of them), because of access to tech, culture, people I've already got connections with, and good walking and hiking countries.

As for signals, the current state of the world's plenty. It's just a matter of access (since I hardly have Peter Thiel money or power).

21 sats \ 0 replies \ @Bell_curve 11 Apr

Good choice

21 sats \ 1 reply \ @kr OP 11 Apr

haha no pressure to share more if you don’t want to, but I’m curious to know why Iceland over other Nordic countries.

is it something unique to Iceland or unique to your personal situation?

62 sats \ 0 replies \ @StillStackinAfterAllTheseYears 11 Apr

It's the latter -- I've got more friends there, so I'd be starting less from scratch.

204 sats \ 2 replies \ @TheWildHustle 11 Apr

El Salvador will look different when bitcoin 10x’s. Some say it might become the Singapore of South America. TheWildHustle fantasizes about selling his fiat condo in two years and continuing remote work, citadel hopping until the monetary premium is drained from shitcoin number 1.

50 sats \ 1 reply \ @PRA3S3NT1A 11 Apr

You mean central america ?

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @TheWildHustle 11 Apr

Apologies Freak,

204 sats \ 0 replies \ @Satosora 11 Apr

Malta I heard you can move and pretty much buy one.

194 sats \ 0 replies \ @Cje95 11 Apr

I think the signals are brightly flashing with the pretty big news story about how the rich in the US are all rushing to get second passports. Reading the article the places I found interesting and could see as pretty nice places are New Zealand and Malta. Both check a lot of boxes with stability both politically and economically.

83 sats \ 0 replies \ @Sofia_Vittar 11 Apr

El Salvador is giving free passport for skilled workers, Bukele just announced that few days ago, check it out

71 sats \ 0 replies \ @dzsobacsi 11 Apr

This guy regularly talks about this topic on YT:

50 sats \ 0 replies \ @davidw 11 Apr

Not wishing to generate FOMO, but requirements and processing times are increasing everywhere. And options will become more limited each quarter.

Countries where it used to take 4-6 months without having contacts to shorten it, now you’d likely be waiting 12 months. The offices are swamped processing new applications. And many will from what I can tell try and curb demand in future or be more selective with criteria. We’re already seeing that.

Also, my theory is that as interest rates prove unable to curb inflation, western countries are going to resort to ridiculous outright taxation this decade to try and get it under control. Both cap gains and income tax. It may be prudent to have a second option lined-up, unless you think you are beyond that reach.

80 sats \ 0 replies \ @gmd 11 Apr

If we're thinking front-running an escape from governmental and societal collapse, I think safety for you and your family has to be the number 1 priority over perceived freedoms. So where is it least likely to devolve into Haiti-like madness and desperation?

New Zealand would seem to fit the bill pretty well- very spacious good resources for sustainable living, and it always felt super safe when I visited (people hitchhiking, leaving cars and doors unlocked etc).

Next I would think a mono-cultural place like Japan or Korean where there is a shared sense of cultural responsibility and pride. Great geographical isolation. Good eats too.

My uneducated gut says probably steer clear of anywhere in the middle east, Africa and most of South America.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @IamSINGLE 11 Apr

Second passport consideration is a big question in itself? You first need to be mentally prepare to leave your homeland, which in my case is India. I'm not ready to leave it because it's what we call our motherland.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @gzuuus_ 11 Apr

Liberation.travel

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @0xbitcoiner 11 Apr

https://nomadcapitalist.com/nomad-passport-index/ 👀

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @Coinsreporter 11 Apr

As an Indian, If you get a second citizenship, you lose your first one. And I don't want to lose it , not for my emotions but for some logic, India is progressing with leaps and bounds and most parts ROW are sinking.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @024d800dfa 11 Apr freebie

Dictatorship and elections are a joke.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @nullama 11 Apr

Any passport from the Schengen Area would probably be very high on that list as allows you free movement to 29 European countries.

I think having another passport is a good idea, as that gives you options. Being stuck in one country is not ideal.

You never know what your country will be in a decade.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @1fatmess 11 Apr

Away from the obvious centres of conflict in contemporary geopolitics: no European, Middle Eastern or South East Asian countries. Leaves only a handful of places.

0 sats \ 5 replies \ @DarthCoin 11 Apr

passports are shitcoins are the ultimate form of obedience. What does it means the word passport?

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @jeff 11 Apr

I agree, every time I get a chance, I point out that borders are invisible and imaginary lines on dirt made up by mostly old dead white men.

It usually makes people pause.

Like timezones.

But - there is so much fucking ink spilled about them.

Super hard not to bend the knee to them, unless you are mega rich.

0 sats \ 3 replies \ @mo 11 Apr

Tell me more about this! How would you travel without a citizen passport? What are the alternatives?

21 sats \ 2 replies \ @DarthCoin 11 Apr

I am not a citizen. I am a sovereign living man. Only citizens have passports because are members of a state. Look closer to this chart and locate yourself. All so called "countries" are corporations. if you call yourself a citizen, that means you put yourself inside these corporations.

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @mo 11 Apr

I know you are not a citizen... but my question is about how do you travel without one? I'd appreciate some of your strategies and learnings.

Do you endlessly face fake authorities with natural law topics? or you just take the sideways and move around with alternative methods?

22 sats \ 0 replies \ @DarthCoin 11 Apr

Walking or in a private vehicle. If you take a plane, use a private one that do not ask questions. Don't you notice that all airports are private companies? Once you buy a ticket you MUST comply their rules because you agree their terms. And those rules are also checkpoints of so called passports. It's all a private corporation but people do not want to see it. It all about a contract you consent. So stop consenting and do it in your way or renegociate the terms.

If you want to play by their bullshit rules with "countries" you can go further and apply what was agreed in 1933 in Montevideo, The Convention on the Rights and Duties of States. https://www.oas.org/juridico/english/treaties/a-40.html

aka your body could be your own country, if you know how to do it right. Wherever you go you are always in your country.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @DiedOnTitan 11 Apr

Ireland. Access to both EU and UK is pretty enticing. I like the people there.
U.S citizen
Travel flexibility, education, healthcare, business environment, geography.
No
Civil unrest. Hyperinflation. Fascism