Looking for tips/tricks for gaining "good enough" receive privacy on Lightning while having a public routing node
1267 sats \ 18 comments \ @sethforprivacy 20 May 2022 bitcoin
Hey all,
I recently spun up my own public routing node (detailed the process and findings here: #29933) but the core remaining issue for me is finding ways to gain strong receive privacy that doesn't link all of my invoices/transactions back to my public/nym-linked node when I need the TX to be anonymous.
The main recommendations I've seen are:
  1. Use a semi-custodial mobile wallet for receives and send funds to your own node/wipe the wallet every now and then to get a new pubkey
  2. Use a non-custodial mobile wallet and open an unannounced channel with your mobile wallet (Breez/SBW/etc.) and then close the channel and reset the wallet when the inbound liq is depleted
Any other recommendations or tips here? I want to have a public node (I have to publicly link it to my podcast, anyways), but I want to also have strong receive privacy like I would expect when avoiding address re-use on Bitcoin etc.
I asked the same question on Twitter as well: https://twitter.com/sethforprivacy/status/1527719148930859009
Nitter link: https://nitter.sethforprivacy.com/sethforprivacy/status/1527719148930859009
write
preview
related posts
41 sats \ 7 replies \ @DarthCoin 20 May 2022
I wrote several guides about LN and how to use it in many different ways, based on my own tests and experience accumulated all these 10+ years using BTC and 3 years in LN:
reply
10 sats \ 6 replies \ @sethforprivacy OP 20 May 2022
Thanks!
Seems to echo my sentiments around having a private node/non-custodial wallet with an unannounced channel from your public node for better receive privacy (though no reason to do this for spending, AFAICT).
reply
8 sats \ 0 replies \ @DarthCoin 20 May 2022
Yes, I found this method as a nice way to play around. You can do it even with a "public" node and Blixt mobile node (as private) for example. Depends on how deep you want to go. A 3rd node (private) also can be used when you have a business for example, you can use it behind that "public shop" node.
If you want to have good routing you have to have at least one good node in "public" mode. And to that connect many other "private" ones.
There are many ways to play around.
reply
10 sats \ 4 replies \ @nullcount 22 May 2022
These setups with multiple nodes can be deployed/mamaged using a new Lightning implementaiton called Sensei.
https://github.com/L2-Technology/sensei
reply
0 sats \ 0 replies \ @sethforprivacy OP 23 May 2022
Ooooh, this looks like it might be perfect! Thanks so much for sharing, will dig into this ASAP.
reply
0 sats \ 2 replies \ @ab 24 May 2022 freebie
I took a look at the docs, but it wasn't clear to me why Sensei would be better than other implementations for spinning up multiple nodes?
11 sats \ 0 replies \ @2big2fail 21 May 2022
unfortunately without routing path blinding i don't thing receiver privacy is possible on lightning https://github.com/lightning/bolts/pull/765
reply
1 sat \ 0 replies \ @Semisol 22 May 2022
My recommendation is you get an inbound private channel to a disposable node, receive, send back to your node.
reply
1 sat \ 0 replies \ @doubleplusgood23 21 May 2022
I listened to your episode on The Bitcoin Dad Podcast. Nice seeing you around here!
reply
1 sat \ 2 replies \ @thrown 20 May 2022
somewhat related post:
“Explain how privacy on Lightning works?” #6947
reply
1 sat \ 1 reply \ @sethforprivacy OP 20 May 2022
Yeah just found and read through that but no real solutions for pubkey re-use on a public node AFAICT :(
reply
5 sats \ 0 replies \ @thrown 22 May 2022
My initial assumption about Lightning was that there were no onchain addresses (more like Grin or Beam). But the more i read about LN, the more I realize that LN doesn’t even use the same vocabulary as privacy coins. They’re speaking a different language. That’s why it’s hard to get straight answers.
reply
1 sat \ 0 replies \ @takaponka 21 May 2022 freebie
Yep, we must take care of privacy with LN and the sidechains. Hopefully bolt12 will bring huge improvement. For now the privacy is okay when u send, for receiving a payment we can't deny it sucks.
0 sats \ 1 reply \ @028273474e 27 May 2022 freebie
I don't understand the issue. Tor your node, open channels with people willing to sell you inbound liquidity. Use an LSP or Magma. Buy from robosats. I don't understand the point of torching your lightning node wallet. Pseudonymous has a much greater anonymity set. You want all the channels you can handle, and them to not have much significance. privacy coins are exactly the same, if few people are transacting, few people to check with. How do you think the binance people got caught, they just got the info from an XMR exchange, only a few people to check on.
0 sats \ 0 replies \ @vindard 22 May 2022 freebie
For 2., wouldn't you still doxx yourself via the route hints through your routing node for the unnanounced channel?