Damus may be pulled from Apple's app store \ stacker news ~nostr

Damus may be pulled from Apple's app store

8476 sats \ 64 comments \ @OriginalSize 13 Jun 2023 nostr

Just now from Damus developer Will:

Damus will be removed from the app store in 14 days, apple says zaps are not allowed on their platform because they could be used by content creators to sell digital content. This is right before I’m about to give my talk at the oslo freedom forum on how decentralized social networks with lightning integration are bringing financial freedom to the masses... pretty sus… 😕

This would be a watershed moment: If people can’t transact freely p2p on their platform, this has huge implications for the entire ecosystem of apps with lightning integration and v4v. https://nostr.build/i/a0b028e5b90ae3ae9fb89284425278f4a229accc6e33ddc62b9bf79b3d106a89.jpg https://nostr.build/i/2376418037dec06d83076b6a5c804c5366a8583d935d321ab0ed177771d40192.jpg

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1445 sats \ 9 replies \ @TonyGiorgio 13 Jun 2023

I've always thought building native iOS apps only was foolish for this reason. You're completely locked in to their platform.

This is why we built Mutiny as a PWA.

127 sats \ 8 replies \ @ek 13 Jun 2023

You even get cross-platform compatibility for free.

Why would someone create native apps anymore? To develop iOS apps, you even have to learn a own language afaik.

For security reasons?

129 sats \ 7 replies \ @TonyGiorgio 13 Jun 2023

Yeah access to secure enclaves is a huge plus.

483 sats \ 6 replies \ @ryu 13 Jun 2023

Will should have prioritized web app and maybe Android development a long time ago.

Hell, Steve Jobs himself was pushing for such a thing in 2007 when people complained about there being no App Store on the first iPhone.

The moment he eased up on the walled garden philosophy as Woz wanted him to, people clamored for decisions to be made for them. Imagine how differently things could have been had people realized the latent potential that Steve had.

200 sats \ 5 replies \ @freed0m 13 Jun 2023

He wouldn't have onboarded as many users with a PWA, and back then, there weren't any external sign in options either - so it would have been horribly insecure.

Things have changed a lot in recent weeks with NIP-07, NIP-46 and the presence of signing devices and software - such that a PWA actually starts to make a lot of sense, particularly in the context of censorship resistance.

I hope that Damus survives without deprecating zaps, I understand he has a call lined up with Apple, apparently came after a tweet to Tim Cook by Jack Dorsey: https://twitter.com/jack/status/1668648607661056000?cxt=HHwWgICzqavEnaguAAAA

@TonyGiorgio / Mutiny has received some Jack Love also! https://twitter.com/jack/status/1668649100819013632?cxt=HHwWgIC90YXhnaguAAAA

FWIW - we're currently building a Nostr app, as a PWA also, to avoid these very issues.

If anyone would like to discuss signing devices, android support, NIP-46, nsecbunker and the likes - would be great to chat. I understand that most devs are on Telegram but there's no way I'm visiting that stink-hole.

10 sats \ 4 replies \ @ryu 13 Jun 2023

The update isn't great, but brings it more in line with what Twitter currently has.

Guess Apple didn't want to be seen as showing favoritism towards a legacy player; surprising since they didn't seem to care about optics too much the last few years.

I wish you luck on your app development, and hope to see (better) signing support come to mobile soon!

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @SatoshiNakanodo 14 Jun 2023

If you don’t update the app will you still be able to zap posts?

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @ryu 14 Jun 2023

Hypothetically yes, don't know if Apple might pull some fuckery though.

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0 sats \ 1 reply \ @freed0m 13 Jun 2023

Yes, just saw that, indeed not a game changer, just unfortunate UX for the iOS peeps. Yet another reason to move over to Graphene and experience freedom from censorship (and tracking).

Thanks! NIP-46 will be amazing once we have some broad support for it. We're building a Nostr Quiz game, and just like SN, zapping content will be a BIG part of it!

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @ryu 13 Jun 2023

The sole method to use signing extensions and WebLN on Android is either using Kiwi Browser or a Firefox Android derivative, which still doesn't have proper site sandboxing (although it's finally being worked on).

Native mobile apps not distributed through Google Play need to come out already.

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974 sats \ 2 replies \ @moel 13 Jun 2023

Could Damus be compiled to WASM and simply be a web app ?

427 sats \ 0 replies \ @duvel 13 Jun 2023

A PWA (Progressive Web App) is always a good solution to bypass the app store on either Android or iOS. On Android the issue of removing the app is not present because you can just install the apk file.

The issue on an Apple device won't be solved. Solution is to use another mobile OS, because all your other installed apps can also be removed from the app store.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @supratic 13 Jun 2023

Great idea, it will give anyone access from any device

1046 sats \ 7 replies \ @erikds 13 Jun 2023

Could you imagine if Apple would apply its own rules consistently.

Any banking-app would be banned because you could use it to purchase or donate something without giving Apple its cut.

53 sats \ 3 replies \ @zuspotirko 13 Jun 2023

It is consistent, banking and online shopping have explicit exceptions in the rules since the very beginning.

0 sats \ 2 replies \ @fiatbad 13 Jun 2023

Fine you win that. But what about the fact that zaps are simply information. Bitcoin is not considered money by Apple. They allow DM's in Twitter, or WhatsApp. I can send emails with pictures, videos. I can send almost any data I want. So why are they censoring Zap data?

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @zuspotirko 14 Jun 2023

Apple should make an exception to decentralized applications. The situation (from their perspective) should be more alike to e.g. a fm radio app. I also wouldn't be too pessimistic that it won't improve in the near future

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @zuspotirko 14 Jun 2023

360 sats \ 1 reply \ @fiatbad 13 Jun 2023

Holy shit, this is a really good point! I hadn't even thought about this. Really pisses me off. I'm done with Apple.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @ek 13 Jun 2023

I think their rules only apply to digital content.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @zuspotirko 13 Jun 2023

It is consistent, banking and online shopping have explicit exceptions in the rules since the very beginning.

875 sats \ 3 replies \ @franzap 13 Jun 2023

We need an alternative Appstore as a Progressive Web App

1091 sats \ 0 replies \ @ryu 13 Jun 2023

AltStore. Small, but growing.

153 sats \ 1 reply \ @1sats 13 Jun 2023

Whenever possible, I prefer using web apps over iOS/Android apps because I can use adblock to block tracking scripts.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @franzap 13 Jun 2023

Yup, can also be done via DNS

650 sats \ 2 replies \ @fiatbad 13 Jun 2023

I was an Apple fanboy back in 1999 when it was taboo and everyone was running Windows PC's. I've used their products forever.

Learning about Bitcoin has changed me. I'm ready to leave Apple. But where to? I know there was an open source Linux-based phone being marketed a few years back. But I haven't seen it since. I feel like Android is going to have similar issues to Apple.... same BS, just a different set of trade-offs. These things are all ridiculously centralized. Where can I go? Anyone have a recommendation?

1 sat \ 0 replies \ @m00ninite 13 Jun 2023

GrapheneOS. It's an Android fork, but it sandboxes all the Google stuff

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @freed0m 13 Jun 2023

Qubes OS for desktop, Graphene OS for mobile

515 sats \ 0 replies \ @2bithits 13 Jun 2023

No more apple products for me

427 sats \ 0 replies \ @energycurrency 13 Jun 2023

deleted by author

222 sats \ 0 replies \ @freed0m 13 Jun 2023

Doesn't this mean that Apple is now formally recognising Bitcoin as a means of payment?

110 sats \ 1 reply \ @siggy47 13 Jun 2023

I'm selfishly hoping this de-apples damus. I am jealous, but I can't bring myself to use an apple product.

21 sats \ 0 replies \ @ek 13 Jun 2023

Same here. It's perhaps a nice garden, but it's still walled.

107 sats \ 0 replies \ @ursuscamp 13 Jun 2023

Hopefully jb55 can just explain that there are no paywalls and they will back off.

106 sats \ 0 replies \ @FrickFrickFrick 13 Jun 2023

Maybe this will push them to create an android build finally.

Really annoyed that there is no nostr client that is truly cross platform. Why is that so difficult?

63 sats \ 0 replies \ @franzap 13 Jun 2023

Isn't bitcoin a commodity though? In the USA at least. So technically this would be bartering

Am I wrong?

53 sats \ 0 replies \ @BitcoinFreedomSiim 13 Jun 2023

Fcuk all the Apples and Googles

54 sats \ 0 replies \ @fixthemoneyfixtheworld 13 Jun 2023

That's disgusting.

Now what's next for Apple? Fountain?

53 sats \ 0 replies \ @axzwk 13 Jun 2023

Hope they dont do this with wallets next

53 sats \ 0 replies \ @guts 13 Jun 2023

He could disable zaps on Damus client but enable them with PWA.

53 sats \ 0 replies \ @faithandcredit 13 Jun 2023

Why are people even trying to fight these monopolies and what not? The world wants to centralize and censor and enslave... So why not let it?

1 sat \ 0 replies \ @siggy47 14 Jun 2023

I just want to point out that I hope no one is planning on sitting down with Apple to "explain the situation " and beg them to reconsider. The writing is on the wall. No reason to further discuss details with them.

1 sat \ 0 replies \ @OriginalSize OP 13 Jun 2023

Elon has chimed in: https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1668686662212132876

1 sat \ 5 replies \ @DarthCoin 13 Jun 2023

Don't be a pussy and cry like a kid... Be a man that doesn't give a shit.

42 sats \ 4 replies \ @dgy 13 Jun 2023

Yes, a freedom loving bitcoiner is not using a closed platform and is therefore not affected by this drama.

A sovereign individual on iOS is an oxymoron.

A free man has control over his computing and is not controlled by a third party.

0 sats \ 3 replies \ @john_doe 14 Jun 2023

I agree but they tried to target the average people with the AppStore. That being said I look at that with distance too (not affected at all and using Amethyst).

1 sat \ 2 replies \ @DarthCoin 14 Jun 2023

You don't go to Apple crying to restore your app... You go and start a campaign where all your app users and bitcoiners will dump the shiny iShit devices in protest and you will see then how Apple will react... Hurt them where is the most important: cash flow

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @dgy 14 Jun 2023

Yes, the only vote that costs something is the vote with your purse. Buying not buying something is the question here.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @john_doe 14 Jun 2023

This reminds me what Richard stallman tried to do for a long time, this doesn't work so well to attract new users. As a long term solution I agree.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Busybe3z 2 Jul 2023

𝐇𝗼𝐰𝐝𝐲 𝐝𝗼 ? 🤠 👋

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Busybe3z 24 Jun 2023

𝐇𝗼𝐰𝐝𝐲 𝐝𝗼 ? 🤠 👋

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @john_doe 14 Jun 2023

I wonder if adding zap functionality as a plugin would work to bypass the rule of Apple. I remember around 2008, Ubuntu started to add non free programs (e.g.: Adobe flash player) on demand during the installation. Maybe adding zap as an option with a checkbox at the start (and make it the default) could work.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @iqb 14 Jun 2023

Is it all about advertising revenue?

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @TheBTCManual 14 Jun 2023

I guess you could use the native app as a watered-down version of the app that meets apples requirements so you can still benefit from their app store exposure but have a PWA and actively advertise, unlock new features by moving to the PWA, work the system and let the market decide for themselves, not apple deciding for the market

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @xz 14 Jun 2023

Felt awesome to install Ubuntu on macOS. Think I'll be doing this more. IOS would be really something if you could install what you wanted to on them.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @bitcoinMoon 13 Jun 2023

JUST IN - Elon Musk says Apple's intent to remove Damus off the app store for its #Bitcoin ⚡️ tipping feature is a "major concern." "This is not a winning scenario." https://twitter.com/BitcoinMagazine/status/1668698772698701826

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @Gian 13 Jun 2023

Apple wants your sats, they are studying a way for get fees from your zaps....

1 sat \ 0 replies \ @f6287b82CC84bcbd 14 Jun 2023

They should just run a lightning node.

Its not like they don't have the money.

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @starbuilder 13 Jun 2023

This is the reason we must pressure our law makers to push Apple to open up App Store to side load apps.